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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 26, 2017 13:33:24 GMT -6
Bringing this quote over to point out that SotN didn't really have an easy mode as they claimed. In fact, I'd argue the stat increases for doing the Richter fight perfectly had a larger, more helpful effect than starting with a single high potion.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 26, 2017 13:26:46 GMT -6
Actually, SotN's starting fight had a really complicated effect on the rest of the game.
You get better stats if you don't get hit when fighting Dracula, and the stats you gain changes depending on what subweapon you have equipped when you beat him
Holy Water HP: 80 MP: 25 Hearts: 60 Str: 13 Con: 12 Int: 13 Luck: 12
Cross HP: 80 MP: 30 Hearts: 60 Str: 13 Con: 12 Int: 12 Luck: 12
Nothing HP: 85 MP: 25 Hearts: 55 Str: 14 Con: 13 Int: 13 Luck: 17
If you win the fight with no hearts remaining, Alucard starts with a Heart Refresh in his inventory. If you collected over 40 hearts as Richter, then Alucard starts with a Neutron Bomb, loses a STR point and gains an INT point. And if you die and Maria has to help you, you forfeit the bomb/refresh and instead get a Monster Vial and a High Potion.
I wouldn't exactly call a starting with a single High Potion "easy mode". To be honest there doesn't really seem to be a lot of rhyme or reason to how or why the Richter fight effects the main game.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 26, 2017 12:27:30 GMT -6
1. The hidden truth about Mac n' Cheese is that it always was, and always will be. It has existed before time. While we attribute its invention to a human, in reality it has existed out there in the universe long before mankind developed the idea to join pasta and cheese. The dark magic of Gebel's castle was able to focus it into existence.
2. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
3. I imagine he'll be in a room that access is blocked off too if you're not a backer. Perhaps backers will get the key, or unlock a portal to his space. God help those who find ways to glitch in there themselves without backing the game.
4. I think she'll probably be able to fly towards the end of the game. It's an Igavania staple and especially considering how much this game seeks to emulate SotN, I don't see how it'd go without such a movement staple. Also almost every promo starts with the logo where Miriam has crystal wings. She'll probably use something like that to fly. (Hm... maybe we'll actually be able to fight while flying. Beyond your typical "shoot a weak fireball" thing. Mid-air boss anyone?)
5. I hope so.
6. I like the cocoon idea. But I'm pretty sure this is an aspect we won't learn till the game is out, since that's pretty spoilery territory.
7. As far as I know crafting is still in the game, but I don't know if it works the same.
8. Again, that's pretty spoilery territory so I don't think we'll be learning it any time soon. But if it's anything like other Vanias, if they did something like this you'd probably just kill him normally but have the option to save him if you do a ton of other arbitrary things around the castle.
9. This question hinges entirely on a single outcome for question 8, and is still very spoilery territory. I'm pretty sure there'll be multiple endings though. I think every Igavania has had them.
10. Yeah. I mean he's got a bit of a Dracula look to him, so he could be a running antagonist if Bloodstained were to become a series.
11. When they were first announced, it seemed like Johannes was to be the second playable character and Zangetsu the third. It sounds like that might have changed though, according to the Shoutbox, so I guess I've missed some things. Pretty positive Zangetsu's going to be playable though since we got his character model and all, and I think that's the only model we've gotten for protagonists outside of MIriam herself. I like the subweapon idea. Perhaps he'll have a few he can change his moveset with similarly to Shards, and maybe some kind of super moves that drain more HP that you can use commands with. I have no idea how they're going to handle Zangetsu though, he seems like a totally new thing. As for classic Belmont whip style, I'm not sure how well they can get away with that in this game. They seem to be trying to change the animations quite a bit to stray from Castlevania. I wonder if doing the full on outstretched whip might step on to many toes. And let's not even get started on if we give that guy Castlevania-styled subweapons. At the very least they might need to run it by a lawyer.
12. Head piece and scarf/(cape?) can change, we know that for a fact. It looks like the outfit, skin color, maybe hair color will be color customizable. It's also confirmed that we will have special outfits we can wear over everything, which are being worked on by the backer clans. (For example, as a member of the Game Grumps clan, I'm probably going to get a really stupid looking gag outfit to make me regret being a Grumps fan.) It's possible this feature may be used for other outfits. Perhaps unlockable costumes? That'd be pretty neat. Also opens the door for DLC, but that's shaky territory.
13. That's Yamane herself? I never knew!
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 25, 2017 17:43:58 GMT -6
In practice, the sound effect shouldn't happen all that often.
Theoretically you'd only hear it once per unique enemy in the entire game, say if there's 300 enemies, then you'll hear it 300 times throughout the enitrety of your playthrough (give or take a few for any ability shards given without an enemy.) And that's only IF you decide to get every shard in the game, which is bound to give you a pretty damn long run time. So all in all, you likely aren't going to hear it a whole lot and especially not super frequently. Maybe a couple times towards the start of the game with easier to get shards but beyond that, not very often at all, even if you're specifically grinding for them.
So I don't mind the scream every time, even if it's the same scream. While I'd enjoy having variations on the scream, it's not something I'd push heavily for if it'd take much time, money, or resources to do at this stage. It's just not that big of a deal, at least in my opinion.
And having a toggle option seems awkward to me. While it makes sense to us in this thread, imagine out of context popping in a new game, going into the options menu, and finding an option to toggle on and off a specific voice effect. It'd make it seem like something was inherently wrong with that voice effect, especially since it's not one that would be heard all that frequently especially compared to her attack sounds or other things like that.
A simple Master/Music/SFX/Voice slider set would do the trick fine, I feel.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 25, 2017 17:20:55 GMT -6
Also, there were cheats for the Playstation that made Alucard pretty much a god with infinite stats and stuff. And yeah, I toggled around with those after I finished the game twice. There was also this weird armor code. Never understood that one, I think it made the game.. Harder? Or? Are you talking about like Gameshark codes?
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 25, 2017 17:16:26 GMT -6
Thanks for this comprehensive reply. Again, I was not stating any reasons why Bloodstained (or most games for that matter) should disregard remapping. Just trying to come up with reasons why quite some titles out there do (these might not always be good or sensible reasons). I think that another reason may be that not many games have yet widely been praised for their "amazing remappable button features" so for many devs, coming up with these systems early enough may slip through the cracks. And so, situations might come up where entire sheets of combo chains might be statically baked onto an image because it was comfortable at the time etc.. Being someone with the QWERTZ keyboard setup (as opposed to QWERTY) I can very much relate to your point about the neccesity of keyboard reconfiguration. Games that inevitably use the y key can be a bit of a pain (especially before I figured out how to change the keyboard layout). Fair enough lol. And I never actually saw a QWERTZ keyboard before until I looked it up just now. It's odd that it's basically the same thing but with Y and Z swapped. Wonder why that's a thing.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 25, 2017 14:26:33 GMT -6
Doing it in a local multiplayer situation (when there isn't a clear P1 and P2 side of the screen) can be complicated, but it's clearly not a situation Bloodstained would be tackling here.
In a single player experience, it's a pretty easy to handle, especially if they're following DRY code philosophy like they should be. Handling button prompts through procedures that you can make minor edits to when the situation arises simplifies the system quite a bit. Then you just go back and call that procedure and have it look up the player's settings when it needs to.
Yes, it's a whole lot better to start this system early than to go back and change all of your instances already layed out (though I'm not too sure how many button prompts Bloodstained will have outside of a tutorial regardless. Maybe in the command skill menu?), but this is something that should really be considered by all developers when starting a game project with the exception of unique circumstances. (Like, for example, Brothers: A Tale of Two Sons's control scheme is imperative to how the game delivers its narrative. I can't see that game being handled in any other way.)
Moreover, for there's always the slightly lazier method some games use (or at least, easier. Can't really call it lazy without knowing the circumstances behind the scenes), where they simply write something like "Press the Attack Button (Default: X)" In which case if the player never changed their controls, they now know to press the X button. And if they have changed the controls, then they should know better than anyone what the Attack button is.
Becomes a little trickier regarding things like overhead prompts, but you can viably use symbols that represent the commands as opposed to literal buttons on the controller.
To be fair, I'm sure this is all a lot easier when talking about a controller than say, keyboard controls though. But at the same time, I'd argue keyboard controls are the most important to allow reconfiguration for as well, because they're darn near impossible to fit to everyone's tastes.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 25, 2017 1:37:01 GMT -6
For many games, this can be time consuming to execute as all on screen button prompts would have change dynamically. What? That's actually surprisingly simple. Compared to the work required for other mechanics, super simple. It could work a little like: You just make strings (labels) for all the buttons. A button would be "A". Right Trigger would be "RT". Then you make variables for the buttons each action is assigned to. var jumpbutton = "A" var attackbutton = "X" ..etc
Then when the player changes it in the options, it changes those variables. Then when you create the procedure that handles the button prompt, it references that variable. jumpButtonPrompt(); if(jumpbutton == "A") img = A.png if(jumpbutton == "X") img = X.png
It's tedious, sure. But it's not even a day's work. An hour or two, tops. And that's an extremely rudimentary way of pulling it off with my limited scripting knowledge— I know there's other features like arrays and switch functions that can pull the above off faster, cleaner, and easier. Not to sound like a know it all, but there really is no excuse for designers to leave out this feature. Its implementation is pretty easy.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 24, 2017 19:16:35 GMT -6
My main concern is gear lock. I understand the point of it for the most part but I like the idea of being able to change at least weapon types. Tests your mastery of the game's mechanics in regards to speed and range and what works better for each enemy.
I think it'd be interesting if it limited what gear you could switch between, but not necessarily completely limit your ability to switch gear.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 24, 2017 1:17:08 GMT -6
Isn't the animations that is bothering me, but the background - the scene - as a whole. It lacks polish and colors. Now, everything seems so blank and lifeless. You have Miriam with bright colors stand out in a dead scene. Not dead by aesthetic, but dead because of the lack of colors, the lack of live in it. I'm noticing though that recent screens and updates to the environments like shown in the DICE interview have done a fair amount in adding more color to the game at least. I'm finally feeling more optimistic about things again. PS Thank you Pure Miriam and others for helping me out with my concerns there.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 23, 2017 16:42:25 GMT -6
None of the games were about rushing through the stages as fast as possible I know it's the exception and not the rule, but I wanted to point out that Harmony of Despair was basically exactly this. And Castlevania hasn't been about precision platforming and taking it slow to critically avoid making mistakes since 1997, save for Chronicles afaik. The closest to that was Circle of the Moon and from what I understand, even that chilled out once you got a good handle of the DSS system. Maybe Ecclesia brought some of that back? I haven't played it. But from the looks of it, precision platforming still isn't a factor.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 23, 2017 13:48:50 GMT -6
(...) I feel the same way about cheat codes, though I don't typically use them on a first playthrough. Also cheat codes are kind of a dead trope nowadays. Depressingly. Interestingly, Bloodstained's going to have them though. I think that's a first for the Igavania series of games? Igavania normally had "cheat codes" in the form of creating a save with the name of a character to play as that character, after you beat the game. As far as i remember, the only Igavania that had a cheat code in the classic sense was Harmony of Dissonance. To play as Maxim in Boss Rush mode, you needed to press and hold the L and R buttons down when in the Boss Rush menu, while to play as 8-bit Simon at Boss Rush, you needed to imput the famous Konami code (up up down down left right left right B A) during Konami logo. Those are secret codes, not cheat codes. Playing as another character isn't cheating (and often in Igavanias, the secret characters are harder than the main game.) And they're not even very secret (at least, not in SotN. It straight up tells you the codes after you beat the game, when you go to start a new one.) Bloodstained's confirmed to have actual cheat codes in the game. Both serious and funny ones. Not just unlockable characters. Actually now that I think of it, SotN did have a cheat code— the 99 Luck one. Although the significant diminish to your HP and such may see it as an alternate playstyle instead of a cheat, much like CotM's playstyles you can unlock with similar methods.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 23, 2017 1:55:10 GMT -6
I suppose with games that are strictly of the horror genre, difficulty changes might be less sensible. That said, part of me still wants to say to give the option if they want— or at least not to go out of the way to ban the option, because even if you and I can't see a purpose in it doesn't mean we should decide that for others. If someone can find an enjoyable experience playing it on Easy despite that, then I don't see why we shouldn't let them, even if it's not an experience we agree with, relate to, or understand. For those who find that experience unenjoyable always have the other options. But for a single player experience, I can't think of a single circumstance on why we'd limit the player's control on how they want to play the game.
I can understand if the developer chooses not to develop the Easy mode because they personally feel it goes against the message they want to create and they're dead set that players enjoy the game the way they intend it. Or if they feel like adding a difficulty that betrays the experience they want to create would be too much effort for something of that sort. But from a non-developer perspective, from the outside looking in, I can't ever really say a game should not have these options, because I feel like the only "wrong way" to play a single player game is in a way you don't enjoy it. If you get enjoyment from it, no matter what you're doing, that's your business and nobody else's.
I feel the same way about cheat codes, though I don't typically use them on a first playthrough. Also cheat codes are kind of a dead trope nowadays. Depressingly. Interestingly, Bloodstained's going to have them though. I think that's a first for the Igavania series of games?
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 23, 2017 0:26:01 GMT -6
Yeah, Shovel Knight is a prime example for people when comparing Yooka Laylee and perhaps the Bloodstained trailers, when discussing the notion of doing Retro but improving upon it with modern understanding of game design. Luckily Iga's worked on games a little more recently than the likes of Banjo, and he's worked in the 2D gameplay space long after 2D was more or less mastered (yes there are still ways in which it can evolve, but the level of changes in the 2D space in the last 10 or even 20 years don't match that of 3D space, especially in terms of control.)
Shovel Knight did have it a bit easier though: It wasn't trying to be a direct spiritual successor. It wasn't sold on the nostalgia of a direct franchise, just games from the era in general. They also weren't trying to revive gameplay styles they themselves pioneered. All in all while it was reminiscent of the style, it was still their very own brand new game, so they still had a lot of freedom with what they did with it. It just had to look and feel retro. It didn't have to look and feel and play like "Mega-Man" or "Banjo" or "Castlevania."
I think when you start making modern day spiritual successors of decade old titles, that becomes a lot harder. It becomes more difficult to take a step back and look at the bigger picture to see the inherent flaws in your old work and how you'd update to the modern age. It tends to be more along the lines of what they would have added 10 years ago to a typical sequel. (I.e. Bloodstained's omnidirectional spells.) Especially when you're specifically selling it on the concept of like "It's like the old games!" Not only is it hard to figure out how to expand this, but I think it's also hard to gauge the line of what you can change, caught between wanting to improve the title and wanting to keep faithful to the fans who funded your project based on the old ways.
Which I guess begs the question: What sort of things would the fans be okay with? If we drastically changed the movement style of Bloodstained to modernize it, it might not feel like Castlevania anymore. It might feel objectively better to those who didn't grow up with Castlevania, but would us backers be okay with something like that?
Iga's got a lot of pressure on his hands to make the best game he can while also keeping as faithful as possible to what his backers expect from this.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 23, 2017 0:12:37 GMT -6
I understand where you're coming from (and especially considering that the Roguelike is not the main feature of this game), though I have to say that the main appeal of Roguelikes is the challenge offered. This will likely be more of a "rogue-lite", because I don't think permadeath (deleting the save) will be a thing in Bloodstained, but the random generation remains. The whole castle will be drastically different each time, to keep players on their toes, possibly in addition to strong enemies appearing much earlier on. It's most likely going to end up that way, anyway. All difficulties will likely be offered even for the Roguelike Dungeon. I'd have no real problem with that, personally (it just seems like it would be appropriate for "Easy" to be eliminated as an option, as I doubt the developers would expect most players to go for the Roguelike Dungeon before playing the main story). The only other thing to bring up is the fact that we still don't know if the Roguelike Dungeon will be in the base-game, or included at a later date away from the game's initial release. After all, IGA & co. still haven't decided on whether they'll go with the "staggered content" release method (allowing for the standard game content to be released first, and all "bonus" content from stretch-goals to be finished and released in later months). I'd just like to have the option there. I tend to always play things on Easy first and then gear up the difficulty until I hit a point where I'm having fun with a decent enough challenge but not getting frustrated to the point where it's not fun anymore. Seeing the sights and being able to make it through the game is more important to me than whether it's imposing enough of a challenge for me. Oftentimes, I am content with Easy and stick with it because it's rare that it's so easy that it bores me. (Though there have been games that were, and I've had to turn it up.) And the prospect of having infinite always different castles to play is alluring to me without necessarily the difficulty aspects. I like the option of being able to start on Easy and then let me decide if I want to make it tougher or not. Because if I don't have that option, and I go in and it's too tough for me, then I may not see it through. And that's just not okay for me. As I said, seeing it through to the end is far more important to me than a challenging experience, or bragging rights/pride. That's something I'll take up later if I decide I want to. And notably, most people have turned Easy mode into an act of shame. I hate starting a new game when in front of someone because I can always feel the judgement when I pick easy. Sometimes I don't pick Easy, just to avoid the social anxiety. It sucks. I hate the stigma people attach to it. And I know it's not just me, I've been with a friend or two not as great at games either who even when they're with me, will sort of hesitate and cringe as they pick Easy mode because they too anticipate judgement. It's ridiculous. And then of course there's the games that have built in features to shame you for picking Easy mode.So yeah, I'm basically always about giving the player the choice. Unless the game or feature's only merit is about the challenge it provides (as in, the only reason anyone would be interested is because it is challenging), I think it should have the option. The only other sort of game I could even think of arguing against that are ones like Dark Souls in which its critical difficulty is integral to the lore in making you take in how bleak and punishing its world is— but even then I'm not 100% sold. I feel that other elements in the game's design from its story to its environment and enemy designs give the picture well enough without necessarily having to completely destroy you, for those who are playing the game to see the sights/learn the lore. (Actually, for games like Souls, I think they could add such a thing in a not-so-obvious to access manner, like a hidden code or something that you'd have to look online for. That way typically your first playthroughs would be the crushing experience as intended, and only players who look specifically for a way to make the game easier will look up and find out the method of doing so. But this is a tangent, my bad.) But the point is, yes: almost always there should be a choice. In fact, I find that games that let you change the difficulty from the options menu at any point in the game (i.e. NieR Automata) are doing it the best. I know this thread was about Roguelike Dungeon, not Difficulty Setting, so my apologies for the thread hijacking.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 22, 2017 17:31:20 GMT -6
While some have played the DS titles, many are coming back to igavanias for the first time since SotN. And even some who dabbled in the handheld games don't want it to be like the handheld games— they want it to play and feel like SotN. That's the trap with pitching your game on nostalgia.
There's also the same issues that came about with Yooka-Laylee— people's expectations were wonky. They weren't driven by a desire to have a carbon copy Banjo game, they were driven by the fantasy of what they remember Banjo to be. I think this is also being applied here, SotN is 20 years old and even Order of Ecclesia is almost 10 years old.
Maybe they're used to wearing speed shoes and the like (Not sure if they're in any of the DS games or anything but there's a lot of speed boosting shoes in Harmony of Despair and the game feels unplayable to me without them now.)
So there could be a lot of factors bringing in these complaints. SotN was also more zoomed in than the other titles too. Being closer to your character can make it seem like you're traveling faster. Also yes, these flaws are more noticeable in a 3D environment. Animations are more committed, you can't skip frames, cancel animations, etc. as easily with 3D models without it being more noticeable. Sprites are created on a frame by frame basis and tend to be easier to tweak. I don't know the full details about that, but I remember reading a post elsewhere that went into more detail about how the 3D models can make it look more sluggish than it is.
I think a lot of people are just straight up concerned too. This is their big chance to have a game like they used to love and they want to make sure it's absolutely perfect before it's too late to make any changes.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 21, 2017 5:33:29 GMT -6
I don't really understand the point in limiting the player's options. If it isn't difficult to create I don't see why it shouldn't have an easy mode. People should be allowed to play how they want to play, especially in a single player experience. Just because you wouldn't want to play it on easy doesn't mean you should vouche to make sure no one can. People have different ways they may enjoy the game and it should be fine to let them explore those options— not everyone's going to have the same experience and that's okay.
Nothing's making you partake in that difficulty so the only reason I can see for saying it shouldn't be offered is that you want to dictate how others are allowed to play. That doesn't really seem fair.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 19, 2017 19:10:03 GMT -6
It will be Atari styled graphics with chiptune versions of eurobeat songs. You'll play as Anne and will be up against Igarashi himself in a twinstick shooter that takes place in the inner mind of a Konami executive tackling the guilt and crippling depression brought about by their actions. It'll have 15 years worth of playtime due to ingenious design opening it up for immense replay value.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 19, 2017 13:32:20 GMT -6
However, I thought you said the same about SOTN's animations too? That I can't agree with, that game is animated beautifully. I wouldn't change a single frame of how Alucard moves. There's a way he animates that looks very slow but there's a perception around it that he's moving so quickly that it looks slow. I know that's hard to understand but it's like whenever he turns around and pulls his cape up there's a very angelic/vampiric way about his animated movements. It works with all the flowing materials he had on him and the after images. Granted all the points about Miriam not having as much in the form of flowing material kinda doesn't allow the same for her. The aura definitely helped it though. The only issue with Alucard I was pointing out was the turning animation. Sure, it looks cool, but it feels slow and unresponsive. Before long, most players skip it by jumping because that's faster and more responsive. That's pretty critical considering the sort of game it is. If I recall correctly, later Igavania's shorten the turning animation by quite a bit and possibly even push you at the same speed as if you were just running forward. Otherwise, for the most part Alucard looks and handles great.
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Post by lovelydumpling on Jun 19, 2017 12:52:56 GMT -6
I wish multiquotes were a slight bit easier to preform in this forum. There's an easy way to do it, it's just not obvious how you're supposed to. If you click the gear icon and then "select post", select all the posts you want to quote and then hit reply, you'll have all of them quoted in the text box. FRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMES Oh. Well neat. Thank you for the info, that will hopefully be helpful in the future. (Tries to think of more words to extend this post so that it seems worthwhile of a forum post.) ... FRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMES Edit: I just read it in my head like how a zombie moans "Braaaains" all of a sudden and it made me think of a satirical dystopian future of PC Master Race zombies talking about that sweet 4kHD60FPS action.
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