ChucklesTheJester
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[TI0] How many nuns would a nunchuck chuck if a nunchuck could chuck nuns?
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[TI0] How many nuns would a nunchuck chuck if a nunchuck could chuck nuns?
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Post by ChucklesTheJester on Dec 24, 2015 5:11:55 GMT -6
The dumbest thing about the outfit I would have to say, for practical purposes mind you, is the heavily armored legs with exposed thighs and torso. Maybe she is just showing off and giving the enemies a fighting chance. lol I dunno why this keeps being such a problem, have you SEEN Shanoa's outfit? Let me also remind you that she has a BARE BACK. To illustrate my larger point, does this strike you as historically accurate either? I thought we would've already established that the outfits of characters in an Igavania game don't need to make any sort of sense.
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Apollonian
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Post by Apollonian on Dec 24, 2015 6:02:28 GMT -6
The dumbest thing about the outfit I would have to say, for practical purposes mind you, is the heavily armored legs with exposed thighs and torso. Maybe she is just showing off and giving the enemies a fighting chance. lol I dunno why this keeps being such a problem, have you SEEN Shanoa's outfit? Let me also remind you that she has a BARE BACK. To illustrate my larger point, does this strike you as historically accurate either? I thought we would've already established that the outfits of characters in an Igavania game don't need to make any sort of sense. I think you misread what I said. Practical purposes = survival so I wasn't talking about historical accuracy. And there is no "problem" with it other than it being my personal opinion that this style of armor would be a hindrance irl, I certainly have no problem with it in the game. As I said my team and I in another game (Medieval style) would run in our underwear. I didn't tell them "Hey, put those clothes back on I have a big problem with the historical accuracy of this. Now put on your heavy armor and help me fight this giant crab!" Simply put I am entitled to feel the armor is poorly designed for practical purposes (heck, for aesthetics too, if I felt that way. It is my opinion after all and it shouldn't be an issue for anyone else) Shanoa's armor gets my approval btw. She is missing some upper thigh armor which is no big deal because it was often cloth or lightly armored since that is a spot that needs to move and bend. She has heavy armor on most of her legs (higher than Miriam's), protected on the sides by a sort of hanging skirt armor as well as a sturdy chestplate. Her unarmored shoulders and back are necessary because of the glyphs and her arms don't have armor because, as we all know, she attacks rapidly with both hands like a drunken mosher. Even if she didn't have the glyphs the unarmored shoulders still work for that reason and the back is a place you ideally wouldn't be showing your enemy anyway. My point is there is a world of difference between the two designs. I am fine with both btw Edit: Just noticed your fanart is missing some of the features I was talking about: Her legs are essentially completely covered because of the higher base armor and the fact that she could pivot to cover that area with her hanging side armor. Miriam would have to outright dodge hence why I find the leg armor to be an issue (from an irl view). Hopefully that clears things up, I don't want to drag this off topic any further
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Cale
Great Old One
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Post by Cale on Dec 24, 2015 12:38:34 GMT -6
Her legs are essentially completely covered because of the higher base armor and the fact that she could pivot to cover that area with her hanging side armor. Miriam would have to outright dodge hence why I find the leg armor to be an issue (from an irl view). Hopefully that clears things up, I don't want to drag this off topic any further One thing to mention about leg armor (which was rarely seen unless a full suit of armor was involved) is that it wasn't necessary. Most combatants either used a long range melee weapon (spear), had a shield (like a buckler for 1 handed weapons, or a bigger shield with a spear like the Hoplite), or a sword to parry any attack to the groin area. Hands hang at a pretty good height to block down there. If we really wanted to get into practical or historical accuracy, what Miriam is missing that is crucial would be a helmet of some sort. My personal preference would be the Steel Bonnet!
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Apollonian
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Post by Apollonian on Dec 24, 2015 13:29:24 GMT -6
I agree, a helmet is a lifesaver. I recall Vegetius (Publius Flavius Vegetius Renatus) complaining that the Romans had become lazy and stopped training with helmets of full weight. I personally like the look of the chalcidian helmet, especially the ones with the reinforced cranial ridge. I am a classics major though so it is expected of me to be biased.
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Cale
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Post by Cale on Dec 24, 2015 17:09:50 GMT -6
I agree, a helmet is a lifesaver. I recall Vegetius (Publius Flavius Vegetius Renatus) complaining that the Romans had become lazy and stopped training with helmets of full weight. I personally like the look of the chalcidian helmet, especially the ones with the reinforced cranial ridge. I am a classics major though so it is expected of me to be biased. Those things are works of art! But as long as the helmet doesn't have horns or anything easy to grab hold of it should be practical enough! Edit: Since you are a classics major, I thought you might appreciate this.
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Zechs
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Post by Zechs on Dec 24, 2015 17:49:18 GMT -6
Speaking of helmets but changing the topic slightly, what about something along the lines of a hachigane or a metal reinforced headband kind of head protection? Something like that would work for Miriam, especially with the other head attire she already has.
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Apollonian
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Post by Apollonian on Dec 24, 2015 17:57:18 GMT -6
I agree, a helmet is a lifesaver. I recall Vegetius (Publius Flavius Vegetius Renatus) complaining that the Romans had become lazy and stopped training with helmets of full weight. I personally like the look of the chalcidian helmet, especially the ones with the reinforced cranial ridge. I am a classics major though so it is expected of me to be biased. Those things are works of art! But as long as the helmet doesn't have horns or anything easy to grab hold of it should be practical enough! Edit: Since you are a classics major, I thought you might appreciate this. Awesome evolutionary tree! I love that kind of thing It took me a while to realize this but you said "But as long as the helmet doesn't have horns or anything easy to grab hold of it should be practical enough!" Miriam's friggin head is impractical. hahaha
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ChucklesTheJester
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[TI0] How many nuns would a nunchuck chuck if a nunchuck could chuck nuns?
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Post by ChucklesTheJester on Dec 26, 2015 4:49:57 GMT -6
You guys can certainly talk about whatever you want, but I certainly do NOT want to get into a discussion about historical accuracy. Nothing in an Igavania game NEEDS to be historically accurate. Iga just usually includes a few things that are as a bonus.
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Apollonian
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Post by Apollonian on Dec 26, 2015 9:58:46 GMT -6
I think that discussion had ended a few pages back. We've just been mentioning historical armor but as you can see our armor choices would definitely not be historically accurate.
Unless Miriam can time travel. Miriam the Victorian-Greco-Roman-Galic warrior...from France.
I would say the game doesn't need to be historically accurate but it should include stuff from the time period he chose, which it already does to some extent and I am sure there is more to come. I think it needs to be historically inspired, Zan's outfit being a great example of that.
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Cale
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Post by Cale on Dec 26, 2015 12:21:45 GMT -6
What I like about these games are the many different items. They usually span many different eras. I would be surprised if we didn't have items thousands of years apart.
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Hyrist
Builder of Castles
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Post by Hyrist on Dec 27, 2015 13:36:43 GMT -6
If I may chime in late to this.
Design wise, I think the shoulder pad puts too much emphasis on the exposed part of Miriam's bust. And while I don't think that's a matter that causes much in terms of serialization tensions. I think it detracts away from the whole aesthetic by putting too much emphasis on one point when it comes to the upper part of her body.
Likely won't be a major impact inside gameplay and boils down to opinions on how people dress or are dressed.
There were likely modeling limitations involved, as has been mentioned. But in the end we have multiple outfits and styles we'll be able to chose from, so I'm not at all concerned, really. If I find myself not liking it, I will simply swap to a design I prefer more. And, on that note, I think we should pause a moment to appreciate that we are given such options in the game.
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Post by allooutrick on Dec 28, 2015 12:51:43 GMT -6
After letting the new design alteration settle in I find myself still in approval of the change and my assumptions that it gives the impression she's trying to hide the curse, and being outpaced by it, lacking. What strikes my curiosity now is how low her outfit sits on her chest. It's still high enough to cover a nipple realistically but it just looks off to me. Like at any moment a high jump can cause some exposure. Just my two cents.
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Cale
Great Old One
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The world is indeed comic, but the joke is on mankind.
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Post by Cale on Dec 28, 2015 19:51:19 GMT -6
If she's trying to hide the curse I have a better solution.
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BalancedHydra
Pillow Weapon Advocate
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Post by BalancedHydra on Dec 29, 2015 6:33:42 GMT -6
If she's trying to hide the curse I have a better solution. What the fudge is that? She (?) looks like Q-bert or Birdo from Mario 2.
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Ciel
Executor of the Church
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Post by Ciel on Dec 29, 2015 11:27:59 GMT -6
If she's trying to hide the curse I have a better solution. *damn image* What
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Post by Valtiel on Dec 29, 2015 12:29:04 GMT -6
As a side note I really hope they go back to the color pallette of the concept art. I like the pale skin and darker clothes and hair and, well, just about everything in the concept art more.
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purifyweirdshard
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Dec 29, 2015 13:00:46 GMT -6
I agree there. Shader 2 Miriam looks closer to the concept art to me as far as coloring/skin, but I like the darker blue of the outfit more than the medium blue shown. Could partially be a matter of lighting.
The circlet/horns headgear thing seems a good deal less curved/different on the model, too. It seems to wrap around her head much less horizontal and downturned, more kind of just vertically draping down.
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Kaius
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Post by Kaius on Jan 7, 2016 7:51:37 GMT -6
I prefer her with a bare shoulder but it will probably be customizable ! I like her pale skin as well, agree with you.
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XombieMike
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Post by XombieMike on Jan 7, 2016 8:59:26 GMT -6
This will be addressed in the next Bloodstained Community Broadcast, and I was surprised at the explanation.
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Cale
Great Old One
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The world is indeed comic, but the joke is on mankind.
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Cale
The world is indeed comic, but the joke is on mankind.
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Post by Cale on Jan 7, 2016 10:59:39 GMT -6
This will be addressed in the next Bloodstained Community Broadcast, and I was surprised at the explanation. Awesome! They are addressing something that is minor, but still important to some of us! I love how much Iga and his team care about this game!
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