Redogan
Monster-Hunting Igavaniac
Fifty Storms
[TI0] Game On!
Posts: 402
inherit
Monster-Hunting Igavaniac
477
0
Nov 22, 2024 9:53:11 GMT -6
373
Redogan
[TI0] Game On!
402
Jul 31, 2015 16:51:36 GMT -6
July 2015
redogan
|
Post by Redogan on Jan 31, 2017 20:28:47 GMT -6
Honestly, the concept art is great for what it is--a concept. I would consider it failure to deliver on primary kickstarter components if the game ended up looking like the concept art. I backed a 2.5D/3D game, not a 2D one. I never (not even for a moment) expected the final game to look like that mock-up that Moo posted.
|
|
purifyweirdshard
Administrator
Administrator
Calling from Heaven
Posts: 3,789
Staff Mini-Profile Theme: Example 2
inherit
Administrator
210
0
1
Nov 22, 2024 16:16:48 GMT -6
3,660
purifyweirdshard
Calling from Heaven
3,789
Jun 29, 2015 7:24:38 GMT -6
June 2015
purifyweirdsoul
Staff Mini-Profile Theme: Example 2
|
Post by purifyweirdshard on Jan 31, 2017 22:58:06 GMT -6
I doubt that most people who backed this game actually expected the visuals to look exactly like the concept art. That's deliberately setting yourself up for disappointment. Especially since it was made very clear on Day One that the visuals wouldn't look like the concept art (It's just a mock-up). Actually, there was a lot of speculation early on that IGA might adopt a technique similar to that used by Arc System Works in Guilty Gear Xrd. Had he chosen to do so, it would have been entirely possible to duplicate the concept art pretty much perfectly. I still think they could get closer than they are now simply by getting rid of dynamic lighting and shadows, and by using a similar shader for the background that is used for Miriam herself. The same art style with bolder shading and without the dynamic lighting to advertise the 3D nature of the objects and actors would look just as gritty while being closer to the 2D side of 2.5D in appearance. It would end up looking like a higher detail version of SotN or Rondo of Blood. This is pretty much exactly what I was imagining ever since I read the KS pitch, and certainly after Xrd was mentioned there. I'm just thinking for whatever technical reason (or actual style choice), they didn't go with that. But yes, that would be about perfect for me. What we have though isn't bad, I think I'm going to be fine with it.
|
|
Galamoth
Ancient Legion
Eternal Guardian
[TI2] Boss of the Floating Catacombs. Hopes nobody finds his hidden Beryl Circlet.
Posts: 3,402
inherit
Ancient Legion
195
0
Aug 19, 2023 8:35:43 GMT -6
2,620
Galamoth
[TI2] Boss of the Floating Catacombs. Hopes nobody finds his hidden Beryl Circlet.
3,402
Jun 24, 2015 13:36:33 GMT -6
June 2015
galamoth
|
Post by Galamoth on Feb 1, 2017 10:22:11 GMT -6
Actually, there was a lot of speculation early on that IGA might adopt a technique similar to that used by Arc System Works in Guilty Gear Xrd. Had he chosen to do so, it would have been entirely possible to duplicate the concept art pretty much perfectly. I still think they could get closer than they are now simply by getting rid of dynamic lighting and shadows, and by using a similar shader for the background that is used for Miriam herself. The same art style with bolder shading and without the dynamic lighting to advertise the 3D nature of the objects and actors would look just as gritty while being closer to the 2D side of 2.5D in appearance. It would end up looking like a higher detail version of SotN or Rondo of Blood. This is pretty much exactly what I was imagining ever since I read the KS pitch, and certainly after Xrd was mentioned there. I'm just thinking for whatever technical reason (or actual style choice), they didn't go with that. But yes, that would be about perfect for me. What we have though isn't bad, I think I'm going to be fine with it. It's easy to imagine that this is what a lot of people were speculating about. However, what was confirmed from the start is that the concept art definitely isn't what they were going for in visuals.
|
|
inherit
45
0
Apr 4, 2023 1:04:01 GMT -6
648
Scars Unseen
[TI0]
560
Jun 8, 2015 23:16:31 GMT -6
June 2015
scarsunseen
|
Post by Scars Unseen on Feb 1, 2017 10:47:01 GMT -6
This is pretty much exactly what I was imagining ever since I read the KS pitch, and certainly after Xrd was mentioned there. I'm just thinking for whatever technical reason (or actual style choice), they didn't go with that. But yes, that would be about perfect for me. What we have though isn't bad, I think I'm going to be fine with it. It's easy to imagine that this is what a lot of people were speculating about. However, what was confirmed from the start is that the concept art definitely isn't what they were going for in visuals. Guilty Gear itself was mentioned in the 2.5D section of the KS FAQ, which was one of the reasons the speculation existed. It wasn't made clear exactly what they were going for at all in the beginning(and the early shader examples showed that they weren't entirely certain themselves). All they said about the concept art was that it was concept art. And when you have the following passage in your FAQ: it's not hard to see where people got from the concept art to thinking IGA was going to use the kind of methods Arc System Works did to try to recreate the 2D aesthetic of the concept art using 3D assets, allowing for a faithful continuation from the classic 2D style while allowing for enhancements not feasible in a sprite based game, such as in-engine cut scenes. I'm not trying to justify some of the more vitriolic whining that happens in some forums lamenting that the game isn't a sprite based 2D game, but it isn't really fair to try to claim that people's expectations for what IGA would do with 2.5D are out of sync with what was claimed when what was claimed was very vague and open to interpretation.
|
|
Galamoth
Ancient Legion
Eternal Guardian
[TI2] Boss of the Floating Catacombs. Hopes nobody finds his hidden Beryl Circlet.
Posts: 3,402
inherit
Ancient Legion
195
0
Aug 19, 2023 8:35:43 GMT -6
2,620
Galamoth
[TI2] Boss of the Floating Catacombs. Hopes nobody finds his hidden Beryl Circlet.
3,402
Jun 24, 2015 13:36:33 GMT -6
June 2015
galamoth
|
Post by Galamoth on Feb 1, 2017 11:14:29 GMT -6
Scars Unseen Though I'll admit that I didn't actually see anything about Guilty Gear in the FAQ when I last looked there. I'll concede to the fact that what was claimed in that part of the FAQ would've been open to interpretation at the time. However, what is not open to interpretation is "Why 2.5D?": "Because this is an Igavania game, the gameplay and feel of the traditional 2D games is non-negotiable".The gameplay & the general feel of this game were the only things truly promised to be close to (if not exactly like) the 2D Igavania experience. Not the visuals. (Edit): The concept art, as well as character design, was also done by Yuji Natsume. I'd say his art-style has been kept in the current visuals.
|
|
Lestaroth
Wall Mac Hunter
Fifty Storms
[TI0]I have returned. Also find me in the credits!
Posts: 465
inherit
Wall Mac Hunter
1804
0
Jul 13, 2019 14:38:11 GMT -6
368
Lestaroth
[TI0]I have returned. Also find me in the credits!
465
Jan 24, 2017 7:35:36 GMT -6
January 2017
lestaroth
|
Post by Lestaroth on Feb 1, 2017 13:44:51 GMT -6
Galamoth I agree with you on this. Was it to be a full entry in the Castlevania franchise, I would rather accept that 2D could be maintained. That said, Bloodstained a new IP, free of bounds and forced management from higher-ups (that sometimes are businessmen who don't even have any experience in the gaming field). Even if is to be a spiritual successor, there is no obligated path on visuals indeed (as long as it is side-scrolling RPG platforming action). Bloodstained got to be original at least or it would be deemed "just a little tribute to old -vanias*). It is also true that some famous series have gone into a radical change of visual style and/or retconned plot. I guess that I am glad I am not into gambling. Mario going into full 3D one day and be the star of a smartphone game another one? I'd have lost big then. *I can sense a lack of emancipation when I write that sort of sample line. That is so strange.
|
|
inherit
7
0
Jun 28, 2019 21:35:13 GMT -6
1,291
CastleDan
1,514
May 28, 2015 9:50:13 GMT -6
May 2015
castledan
|
Post by CastleDan on Feb 1, 2017 19:39:08 GMT -6
I doubt that most people who backed this game actually expected the visuals to look exactly like the concept art. That's deliberately setting yourself up for disappointment. Especially since it was made very clear on Day One that the visuals wouldn't look like the concept art (It's just a mock-up). i actually like how it looks better than the concept art. The concept art had a iPhone game look to it. I did like the sample animation clip the most though, I preferred the cardboard cut out looking backgrounds. Really gave it a 2d game look.
|
|
Jango
New Blood
Posts: 72
inherit
509
0
Oct 19, 2018 19:35:22 GMT -6
104
Jango
72
Aug 4, 2015 13:00:30 GMT -6
August 2015
jango
|
Post by Jango on Feb 2, 2017 5:44:50 GMT -6
Im really glad the game isn't looking like that concept image of Miriam fighting monsters. The color saturation felt like it was almost fatiguing when you look at that image for more than a minute. Beyond that the image was just too busy. The high saturation coupled with that level of business had the effect of the characters fighting for focus with the background.
But Im very happy with what we've seen since. Im glad that Iga wasn't afraid to push beyond the limits of the 2d aesthetics and really use the 3d medium's strengths and benefits. After all, if he wanted to do a purely 2d game he would have.
|
|
LeoLeWolferoux
Wielder of Emptiness
Fifty Storms
[TI0] ...an intellectual with no room for feelings...
Posts: 673
inherit
Wielder of Emptiness
1573
0
Jun 8, 2024 22:55:53 GMT -6
438
LeoLeWolferoux
[TI0] ...an intellectual with no room for feelings...
673
Jun 25, 2016 1:34:49 GMT -6
June 2016
leolewolferoux
|
Post by LeoLeWolferoux on Feb 6, 2017 3:37:34 GMT -6
Im really glad the game isn't looking like that concept image of Miriam fighting monsters. The color saturation felt like it was almost fatiguing when you look at that image for more than a minute. Beyond that the image was just too busy. The high saturation coupled with that level of business had the effect of the characters fighting for focus with the background. But Im very happy with what we've seen since. Im glad that Iga wasn't afraid to push beyond the limits of the 2d aesthetics and really use the 3d medium's strengths and benefits. After all, if he wanted to do a purely 2d game he would have. Probably. But...I believe that 2D pixel art would be a lot more time and resource consuming; everything would have to be hand-made, right?
|
|
Jango
New Blood
Posts: 72
inherit
509
0
Oct 19, 2018 19:35:22 GMT -6
104
Jango
72
Aug 4, 2015 13:00:30 GMT -6
August 2015
jango
|
Post by Jango on Feb 7, 2017 6:07:45 GMT -6
Im really glad the game isn't looking like that concept image of Miriam fighting monsters. The color saturation felt like it was almost fatiguing when you look at that image for more than a minute. Beyond that the image was just too busy. The high saturation coupled with that level of business had the effect of the characters fighting for focus with the background. But Im very happy with what we've seen since. Im glad that Iga wasn't afraid to push beyond the limits of the 2d aesthetics and really use the 3d medium's strengths and benefits. After all, if he wanted to do a purely 2d game he would have. Probably. But...I believe that 2D pixel art would be a lot more time and resource consuming; everything would have to be hand-made, right? Indeed it would,but I dont think that Iga or Inti were worried that they wouldn't be able to finish a pixel art game in a timely manner. Both Iga and Inti have made lots of games that use pixel art. Inti always did a great job when they were making the Megaman Zero games. Knowing that it seems fairly likely that they wanted to go 3d and do something different than all their old games.
|
|