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Post by Olrox on Nov 4, 2016 10:04:56 GMT -6
I have been thinking more. IGA should deliver the Wii U version because it was a part of the Kickstarter campaign. Armature is handling both Wii U and Vita ports and I hope they can finish their work. It is fair to make it because it was one of the goals of the Kickstarter. Many supporters backed for Wii U version, and as other goals, this one should be fulfilled. It doesn`t really matter if Wii U will be relevant or not in 2018, it matters that it was one of the goals/promises. At the moment of the campaign and coming up with stretch goals, they already knew that Wii U is at the end of its life cycle. Now that Switch has been announced, it makes sense to make Bloodstained port for it as well. As Unreal engine 4 will be supported on NS, it will be easy enough to make a port. The NS port can be financed by the publisher and this version can do really well on the market. So, yeah, I am saying both Wii U and Switch versions should be done. Wii U as part of the campaign, and additional NS version which will probably sell very well. The problem is how, Ben explicitely told us there is no money for that. It's either the Wii U or the switch. Also no, they didn't knew the Wii U was at the end of it's life cycle. No smart businessman makes a game for an obsolete console, IGA himself said it, you should always aim for the newest console because that's what sells the most.
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Post by ReySol on Nov 4, 2016 11:15:12 GMT -6
I have been thinking more. IGA should deliver the Wii U version because it was a part of the Kickstarter campaign. Armature is handling both Wii U and Vita ports and I hope they can finish their work. It is fair to make it because it was one of the goals of the Kickstarter. Many supporters backed for Wii U version, and as other goals, this one should be fulfilled. It doesn`t really matter if Wii U will be relevant or not in 2018, it matters that it was one of the goals/promises. At the moment of the campaign and coming up with stretch goals, they already knew that Wii U is at the end of its life cycle. Now that Switch has been announced, it makes sense to make Bloodstained port for it as well. As Unreal engine 4 will be supported on NS, it will be easy enough to make a port. The NS port can be financed by the publisher and this version can do really well on the market. So, yeah, I am saying both Wii U and Switch versions should be done. Wii U as part of the campaign, and additional NS version which will probably sell very well. The problem is how, Ben explicitely told us there is no money for that. It's either the Wii U or the switch. Also no, they didn't knew the Wii U was at the end of it's life cycle. No smart businessman makes a game for an obsolete console, IGA himself said it, you should always aim for the newest console because that's what sells the most. Ben did the math wrong so I didn't want to listen more (at 37:25 of the podcast): 100 unit sales x 30 USD = 3,000 USD 1,000 unit sales x 30 USD = 30,000 USD 10,000 unit sales x 30 USD = 30,000 USD At the time of the campaign Wii U was Nintendo's console and this goal (the same as the Vita port) pushed more backers to participate and make the project even more successful. They should definitely try to make the Switch version (with money from publishers?) because it makes sense. It should cost less because Switch will support Unreal Engine 4. The Switch version can sell really well and make profit. The poll for the Wii U backers should be done, with the option to change the selected version to NS and then they can decide what to do. I will change my version to Switch, although I would also like to get both versions. I think that the outcome of Wii U version also depends on Armature, on the status of their work on porting Unreal engine 4 games to Wii U. Maybe they are finished with their code, or maybe they have troubles. Many disccussions have to be done before deciding the next move. As I said, I trust in IGA and I will support whatever he chooses to do. Armature:
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Olrox
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Post by Olrox on Nov 4, 2016 12:50:42 GMT -6
The problem is how, Ben explicitely told us there is no money for that. It's either the Wii U or the switch. Also no, they didn't knew the Wii U was at the end of it's life cycle. No smart businessman makes a game for an obsolete console, IGA himself said it, you should always aim for the newest console because that's what sells the most. Ben did the math wrong so I didn't want to listen more (at 37:25 of the podcast): 100 unit sales x 30 USD = 3,000 USD 1,000 unit sales x 30 USD = 30,000 USD 10,000 unit sales x 30 USD = 30,000 USD They need aprox 8k units sold to port it (considering the cost of the port at around 250k as the needed stretch goal in the initial campaing). Also that is money they DON'T have right now, which would make the profit of the Wii U just break even, they would need at least another 10k units sold after that to have some profit from that console at all. It's a lose lose situation no matter what, they don't have the money to port it right now, and they would lose all the profits they could eventually make just by costing the port. Bloodstained would be lucky to sell 1,000 or more units for the Wii U by 2018, also said by them. Never mind 18,000 copies to get a decent profit from that version, thats just not realistic.
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Post by LordKaiser on Nov 5, 2016 16:16:05 GMT -6
Whether the Wii U version will sell or not is very relevant. While campaign goals are important, they aren't all important. Ultimately, a product needs to sell. Even when money isn't your primary goal for making something, if it doesn't make money, you can't make another product afterward(unless you've already got funds to keep you going in the long term). The Wii U version shouldn't exist solely for the benefit of the backers, especially if porting the game would cost more money than the Wii U backers put in in the first place. Other Kickstarters have dropped ports when they were determined to be detrimental to the project, and IGA should be allowed the same latitude. How said backers are handled should such event occur is something that should be between him and them, but the existence of a port for a dead system is something that should carefully be considered, and not kept on solely because a plan was made before the system's imminent demise was known. That's a valid point, this thing needs to sell and the Wii U may held this game back. I'm sorry Wii U only owners but I've changed my vote at the poll so now I went to a Yes.
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Post by JXBunnyMachine on Nov 8, 2016 1:07:17 GMT -6
I VOTE YES! I have a PS4 version reserved but I'm intending to changing it to the NS for the portable Nintendo nostalgia of taking my metrodvania on the move like I've done with my past Castlevania games on my 3ds.😏
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Nov 8, 2016 8:32:42 GMT -6
I VOTE YES! I have a PS4 version reserved but I'm intending to changing it to the NS for the portable Nintendo nostalgia of taking my metrodvania on the move like I've done with my past Castlevania games on my 3ds.😏 The idea is certainly very appealing! I think that notion alone may move a good bit of copies, certainly for those that don't have PS Vitas...and even for some that do.
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Post by Valtiel on Nov 9, 2016 22:45:21 GMT -6
I personally would be in favor of it, but while I own a Wii U (since launch, no less) it's one of several systems I own. I assume the folks with only a Wii U wouldn't be too keen on the idea. Since a Wii U version was promised (and presumably funded) by the campaign it'd probably be best to follow through with that promise, unless an overwhelming majority of the Wii U backers approve of canceling it in favor of a Switch version. And even then the Wii U backers who don't approve should be offered full refunds should that version be scrapped.
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Post by BalancedHydra on Nov 10, 2016 9:25:24 GMT -6
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Post by Aztec on Nov 10, 2016 16:20:39 GMT -6
Now with the WiiU being officially confirmed to ending production in Japan soon it's a matter of time before it happens in the west. And with the Switch only 4 months away I don't think we'll have to wait too long for that to happen.
Cancel Bloodstained on WiiU in favor of a Switch version. Let WiiU backer change their pledge to any other platform, including Switch, and finally offer refunds to those left unsatisfied.
There's no other way. It's what's best for Iga and this new game we hope can become a successful franchise.
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Post by giwagiwa on Nov 11, 2016 1:00:16 GMT -6
Aside from that being impossible(since there's no way to restrict people by tier on this forum) and pointless(since this isn't an official poll), it's also arguably imprudent. Whether or not funds get spent on a port for a platform that will be dead by the game's release or not is something that concerns everyone. Even if there are enough Wii U backer funds to entirely fund the port on its own(and I doubt it), that would essentially mean that the Wii U backers would only be funding the port rather than the game itself. If changing from a Wii U port to a Switch port is better for the overall future of the game, then everyone has a right to be heard on the matter. I don't even know where to begin with the logical fallacies in this statement, but let me just narrow it down to this. IGA & co. promised a Wii U port if the stretch goals were met. And they have yet to come out and say that's a financial problem. Let's not forget this golden fact, because: 1. Everything in your statement (over half of it) relating to concerns over funds and percentage of Wii U backers is completely baseless and simply doesn't matter. 2. It isn't up to you to judge how the project is doing financially. The real concern here is not about money or the future of the franchise. The game is going to be on PC, PS4, and Xbox One. Just being released on ONE of those is enough to secure a future for the franchise. Additional ports (NX) can be funded with money made after the game's initial release, after all. FYI, I wasn't suggesting it's technically possible to limit the poll in this forum, was expressing that's how it should be done.
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Post by gunlord500 on Nov 11, 2016 2:01:13 GMT -6
Aside from that being impossible(since there's no way to restrict people by tier on this forum) and pointless(since this isn't an official poll), it's also arguably imprudent. Whether or not funds get spent on a port for a platform that will be dead by the game's release or not is something that concerns everyone. Even if there are enough Wii U backer funds to entirely fund the port on its own(and I doubt it), that would essentially mean that the Wii U backers would only be funding the port rather than the game itself. If changing from a Wii U port to a Switch port is better for the overall future of the game, then everyone has a right to be heard on the matter. I don't even know where to begin with the logical fallacies in this statement, but let me just narrow it down to this. IGA & co. promised a Wii U port if the stretch goals were met. And they have yet to come out and say that's a financial problem. Let's not forget this golden fact, because: 1. Everything in your statement (over half of it) relating to concerns over funds and percentage of Wii U backers is completely baseless and simply doesn't matter. 2. It isn't up to you to judge how the project is doing financially. The real concern here is not about money or the future of the franchise. The game is going to be on PC, PS4, and Xbox One. Just being released on ONE of those is enough to secure a future for the franchise. Additional ports (NX) can be funded with money made after the game's initial release, after all. FYI, I wasn't suggesting it's technically possible to limit the poll in this forum, was expressing that's how it should be done. I respect the points you're making, giwagiwa, but let's try to be a little more measured. I don't think Scars Unseen's concerns were baseless, as many other folks have also raised them. And only IGA himself, or our official team members like Mana, Fangamer Steve, etc. can tell us how finances are or what the future of the series might be. So don't be too quick to lay out some harsh words; remember that he's a fan with concerns, just like you. Your concerns are legitimate too--don't think I'm chastising you harshly or anything, just a reminder for civility. Anyways, we can edit posts, but I don't think we can edit polls themselves, that's something different. I think if we wanted new options someone would have to make a whole new poll. But this one is good for now, so no need to worry
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2016 2:55:50 GMT -6
I love how they confirmed this just after denying it a few weeks back. Why is Nintendo such a shitty company?
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Post by LeoLeWolferoux on Nov 11, 2016 3:26:21 GMT -6
I love how they confirmed this just after denying it a few weeks back. Why is Nintendo such a shitty company? I wouldn't use Nintendo's approach at the audience as leverage for gauging what they're capable of.
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Post by BalancedHydra on Nov 11, 2016 7:57:44 GMT -6
I love how they confirmed this just after denying it a few weeks back. Over simplification, Nya. Nintendo only denied the production of Wii U would cease last week. Not once did Nintendo say anything about WHEN the cease and desist will come into effect.
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Post by Aztec on Nov 11, 2016 11:42:17 GMT -6
Aside from that being impossible(since there's no way to restrict people by tier on this forum) and pointless(since this isn't an official poll), it's also arguably imprudent. Whether or not funds get spent on a port for a platform that will be dead by the game's release or not is something that concerns everyone. Even if there are enough Wii U backer funds to entirely fund the port on its own(and I doubt it), that would essentially mean that the Wii U backers would only be funding the port rather than the game itself. If changing from a Wii U port to a Switch port is better for the overall future of the game, then everyone has a right to be heard on the matter. I don't even know where to begin with the logical fallacies in this statement, but let me just narrow it down to this. IGA & co. promised a Wii U port if the stretch goals were met. And they have yet to come out and say that's a financial problem. Let's not forget this golden fact, because: 1. Everything in your statement (over half of it) relating to concerns over funds and percentage of Wii U backers is completely baseless and simply doesn't matter. 2. It isn't up to you to judge how the project is doing financially. The real concern here is not about money or the future of the franchise. The game is going to be on PC, PS4, and Xbox One. Just being released on ONE of those is enough to secure a future for the franchise. Additional ports (NX) can be funded with money made after the game's initial release, after all. FYI, I wasn't suggesting it's technically possible to limit the poll in this forum, was expressing that's how it should be done. I take it you didn't hear the latest Bloodstained Community Broadcast podcast where XombieMike interviewed Ben Judd. A bunch of truth bombs about the state of the WiiU were laid out including how they need the game to make money in order to continue and spending a lot of money on a dead console is not going to help them. Go listen to it. Hopefully you'll understand why it doesn't make any sense. Also you talk about baseless arguments but then you make a very extreme one declaring that Bloodstained will be a resounding success if it was just released on one current platform. How's that for a baseless statement? Bloodstained is an indie, new, and niche IP that needs all the help it can get to be noticed. Bloodstained won't be the first or the last KS game that has to cancel ports for the good of the property. And Judd said in the podcast that releasing a late port after launch will hurt said port's sales immensely putting at risk said version's profitability. And as long as they give WiiU backers the option to switch to another platform (including the Switch) or give refunds to those unsatisfied I don't see why this should even be a problem. The poll on this very thread tells me it won't be an issue.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2016 3:03:39 GMT -6
I wouldn't use Nintendo's approach at the audience as leverage for gauging what they're capable of. The way a company treats its customers is pretty darn important. Besides, it's not like this is their one and only blunder when it comes to business choices. Over simplification, Nya. Nintendo only denied the production of Wii U would cease last week. Not once did Nintendo say anything about WHEN the cease and desist will come into effect. "There is no change to our continuing [Wii U] production." "Even though the Nintendo Switch is slated to go on sale, [Wii U] production is scheduled to continue."
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Post by Astaroth on Nov 12, 2016 9:38:07 GMT -6
What if their schedule hasnt changed, and the wiiu is still scheduled to stop production on the exact aame day they had a year ago? They were asked about when an apple would stop being shipped, and they talked about apple season, its a misdirect not a lie
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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2016 2:54:36 GMT -6
What if their schedule hasnt changed, and the wiiu is still scheduled to stop production on the exact aame day they had a year ago? They were asked about when an apple would stop being shipped, and they talked about apple season, its a misdirect not a lieIt is one or the other, depending on how lenient you are with the implications behind the statements and therein lies the problem. Regardless of which of the two labels you pick, the act remains a deliberate deception.
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Post by Sunraiser on Nov 13, 2016 12:10:54 GMT -6
Honestly, at this point, I would rather see Bloodstained on the 3DS than the WiiU. I was always sorely disappointed that we didn't unlock a 3DS version, I'd love to be able to play it and collect streetpasses for things like potions and wall-roasts lol. Short of that, I would much rather see it on the Switch than an outmoded console. Nintendo announced that production of the WiiU will cease, the console is officially 'dead'. Let's not be bitter over it, instead let's move on and make use of the Tegra chip in the Switch for Bloodstained's beautiful back and foregrounds. <3
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Post by LeoLeWolferoux on Nov 13, 2016 15:49:13 GMT -6
Honestly, at this point, I would rather see Bloodstained on the 3DS than the WiiU. I was always sorely disappointed that we didn't unlock a 3DS version, I'd love to be able to play it and collect streetpasses for things like potions and wall-roasts lol. Short of that, I would much rather see it on the Switch than an outmoded console. Nintendo announced that production of the WiiU will cease, the console is officially 'dead'. Let's not be bitter over it, instead let's move on and make use of the Tegra chip in the Switch for Bloodstained's beautiful back and foregrounds. <3 Yeah, it is very strange that there was a Vita port, and a Wii U port, (two systems, one a handheld, and one by Nintendo) but the 3DS wasn't a stretch goal? Very weird. Especially since the past three games were all on the DS Light. :/
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