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Post by lai on Sept 4, 2019 14:08:38 GMT -6
Regular uploads will be continuing and Part 5 is up!
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Post by lai on Sept 3, 2019 12:36:32 GMT -6
The whip has a very specific coverage in an arc in front and below Miriam. It will whiff smaller enemies in your face (which is were the dead zone is.) but hit enemies behind your head. It takes awhile to figure out the dead zone, but it is consistent.
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Post by lai on Aug 28, 2019 14:38:44 GMT -6
Part 4 is up!
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Post by lai on Aug 24, 2019 14:21:07 GMT -6
Part 3 is up!
Notice: I'm currently on a trip and I only managed to record and upload enough for one more episode which will be out next Wednesday. The episode after that will be out about a week later.
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Post by lai on Aug 21, 2019 12:51:51 GMT -6
Part 2 is up!
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Post by lai on Aug 20, 2019 22:32:33 GMT -6
Dom That's not a bad assessment of Dominique + Bael. Maybe the word you're looking for there is his avatar? I'd admit that I want her story to be over so I don't have to bear the pain anymore of her betrayal haha. Using Anne like that is potentially quite devious. I'm not sure Miriam/Johannes will be the types to hide the truth for long though, and if Zangetsu ever has any interaction with Anne, I imagine he has zero conversation filter. YES! AVATAR, THAT'S THE WORD I WAS LOOKING FOR, THANK YOU! UUHHHH HYDRO STORM! Sorry, I couldn't resist.
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Post by lai on Aug 20, 2019 0:44:21 GMT -6
Excellent video/write-up! I'll be putting my own thoughts/reactions to the characters and what you say in their own sections within spoiler tags. I wrote this on a whim so it might get a bit hard to read at times. Miriam I find Miriam to be closer to "Leon" and ROTN closer to LOI in terms of story placement. A jumping off point for other games in the franchise for newcomers, requiring no previous experience to get into the story. Even if ROTN is in the middle of the story, it requires no previous experience in the franchise to enjoy and understand, something we can't say for sure about potential future games.
I personally wouldn't have Miriam as the protagonist to a sequel as there isn't many places she could go without some major changes. She's a paragon through and through so barring going insane and unrecognizable as a character I don't think she could become a villain the same way Soma could. I'd probably give the corruption storyline/mechanics to either Gebel (in a prequel) or to a new protagonist as the chance for it to happen to Miriam was admittingly wasted and now even less likely given the ending of ROTN.
Regardless of her role in the future, I'm with you on the romance thing. Johannes If whip won the vote, I can see the Zangetsuto being replaced by an enchanted whip made by Johannes. However I can't really see Johannes in a MC role as even his best work was basically plagiarizing Alfred and he's implied to not be good at fighting anyway.
Johannes in prequels would probably serve the same support role to Gebel as he did Miriam, giving him a front-row seat to Gebel's fall.
For sequels, he probably could become a master alchemist, but I don't see that happening any time soon. He's totally gonna adopt Anne if Anne is going to have any future appearances. Gebel Gebel is probably the No. 1 candidate for a prequel protagonist. The corruption theme can be easily explored with Gebel as we've seen the results and he already has a story, finishing off the alchemists and maybe fighting off the demons as well with the potential that Gebel stops an alchemist from summoning Bael and getting his hands on the Liber Logaeth in the process. Maybe he knew Dominique's parents and maybe he has something to do with their deaths. The story would probably end with him being possessed by Gremory. The only problem I have with what I've outlined above is that Zangetsu clearly hasn't met Gebel before or at least non-possessed Gebel at least not to any significant extent since it's shown Zangetsu hates shardbinders when ROTN begins and he could clearly care less about Gebel's survival which would be odd given how much Zangetsu cares for his comrades.
For sequels, I can see Miriam trying to find a way to reverse Gebel's crystallization and this would probably be the only spot where she'd be willing to bend her morals, but she would know that Gebel would rather stay dead than for Miriam to turn back on her morals so this doesn't go very far. Or maybe she takes some sort of Faustian bargain, sacrificing her power for Gebel's life. Gremory She's gonna be in every game. No doubt. Anne I never really thought of Anne being put into a MC role, but I think she has the most potential in sequels so I wouldn't be against it. Given how readily she takes up the mantle of shopkeeper and appears to have a knack for it as she does a pretty good job despite only having experience from observation. I mean she apparently learned how to purify shards, aka partially unstable demonic power, despite only being "showed" how to do it. Gameplay-wise I can see her playing the Vincent role in the future, but story-wise be more of a financial supporter ala Speedwagon as young enterpriser.
The fact she's in the dark about Dominique's true nature does bring up some interesting future potential if Dominique also returns as she could feasibly be manipulated by Dom as she is unaware, more on that in the Dominique section. Dominique Now while I do see Dom as a Barlowe I also think she pulls double duty as a Mathias. I actually don't think she's done yet for sequels because if Bael is Chaos, I think Dominique would make a decent Mathias. The way I believe this would play out would be that she actually successfully merged with Bael and works as an avatar of sorts for Bael that needs to bring Bael back via proper summon in order to access Bael's full power. In this case she got what she wanted, power to slay god, but it is as much a shackle and a burden as it is ascension as she's doomed to forever attempt (and be thwarted) to bring Bael back or be completely subsumed by the very entity she is now a part of if her actions ever stray from that goal.
Now back onto that Anne point. I can see Anne being manipulated by Dominique into helping Dominique's plans if she is kept in the dark about Dominique's nature. This can result in some interesting scenarios such as Anne having the best intentions for everyone but Dominique still has her help bring back Bael.
As for prequels, Mr and Mrs Baldwin have a lot of potential to explore as does young Dominique. If a Gebel prequel has him working alongside the exorcists I can see Dom's parents dying in the process of helping Gebel stop the alchemists and maybe have Gebel break the news to young Dom saying something like "I wasn't strong enough." Alfred Just want to say that I always guessed Alfred wasn't going to be a villain. I was really happy when I found the journal entry saying the "old friend" was getting close to the children because then I realized that alongside Miriam's "you were like a father to me" line that the old friend and Alfred were the same guy and that Alfred was good all along.
For prequels, I actually don't think Alfred would be particularly active. Given that everyone is surprised he's alive, I'm assuming he either faked his death or just went underground to bide his time. So I don't think he'd show up in the prequels at least not in person. Zangetsu Given that we already of the COTM subseries, I doubt Zangetsu will be having his own mainline games, but I believe the original COTM covered Zangetsu's journey to England you could say it was a Journey to the West or his life in Japan. We all know he's alive, but IDK what roles in sequels he will play now that Miriam has inherited his duty.
Prequel Zangetsu deserves his own classicvania style adventure chasing down Gremory in Japan and England but I don't think his story would intersect much with Gebel's. Bloodless, OD, IGA Conflating these 3 because there isn't much to say about them individually.
Bloodless could be Bloodstained's "legion", a reoccurring boss that ultimately has little plot relevance, but has subtle changes with each appearance to keep the fights interesting.
I don't see OD really doing anything outside of being his ol' librarian self as he just does not care about anything not relating to his books. He'll do favors for the heroes when he appears but I don't see him being proactive in helping them or the world at large unless they ask.
I'd be perfectly happy if IGA is canonized as a "giant space flea castle architect." There's almost no way you can make him canon in a method that isn't completely or half bonkers outside of saying he's just there and no one knows why, who, or how but he built these castles and that's it. Bael Much of what I could mention here has already been mentioned in the Dominique section. In short, Dominique becomes the main brain of Bael but is at risk of being consumed by Bael if she does not attempt to bring Bael back every time she returns to the human world. Prequel Gebel as the protagonist with the corruption theme. Gebel works to finish off the Alchemists and help stop the flow of demons (maybe those two goals are the same). The entire Baldwin family makes an appearance but Dom loses her parents. Alfred doesn't show up and neither does Zangetsu, but they are both present in the setting. In the end Gebel finishes off the Alchemists but the demons keep coming. He tries to use THE BOOK to stop it but is in turn controlled by Gremory or put in a coma to be shipped to Gremory. Maybe Gremory was locked inside the book or something. This would take place soon after the demons first appear in the initial waves of the invasion.
I do not think Zangetsu would defeat Gremory, despite chasing her to England, as his first proper encounter with Gremory seems to be during the events of ROTN given how terrified Gremory is of him. Sequel I'd rather have a brand new protagonist in a seemingly distant/unrelated setting ala OOE. Show how other parts of the world reacted to the existence of demons and the countermeasures they developed, once again, like OOE please just make OOE but modern. Have the cast of ROTN serve in supporting roles with Miriam specifically being a mentor of sorts to the new protag. There is potential for Anne unintentionally "betraying" the group by being manipulated by Dominique because Johannes and Miriam didn't want to break it to her. Oh yeah and Dom would be the main villain now that she is essentially Bael and would be working with Gremory to bring about Bael's return. I'll probably expand on these later but for now these are the basics of my thoughts and predictions. Also if IGA does read these I just want to tell him, "Just because some people on the internet guessed what you have planned doesn't mean you need to change those plans. This also means don't feel pressured if a lot of the fanbase wants something you don't have planned. Pay-off and quality>Surprise/shock value and needless pandering."
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Post by lai on Aug 18, 2019 14:00:38 GMT -6
Hi there! I'm doing an all bosses playthrough of Bloodstained ROTN using only skill shards (although I call them relics, you can't change my mind), shards required for puzzles or progression, and passive shards that do nothing for me (i.e. augment int). This will also apply to my grinding which will be linked to in the part following it. Expect each of the parts to be around 20-25 minutes long with most of the story sections being skipped as well as deaths that accomplish nothing. I will not be going for boss medals as I already have a guide for that. I should be uploading a new part every 3 days. Every new part will be linked here are a reply to this thread. Playlist link: www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLFCNSvQMBJpkhnenVSqzv48NueGgtTLVmFirst Part:
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Post by lai on Aug 18, 2019 13:39:30 GMT -6
There isn't really much you can do to make the game more difficult outside of just buffing enemy stats and placements to absurdity. The reason why NG+ is so easy is because you have access to all of your combat tools from the get go, power doesn't really matter as much. It doesn't matter if there's 50 enemies in a room if I never need to go near them because Tis Rozain/recycle hat/timestop+glasses lets me snipe them from across the screen at zero risk and cost.
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Post by lai on Aug 9, 2019 23:17:48 GMT -6
I had a question about one of the nerfs. I read on another forum that a level 90 dullahammer head was doing 5 damage. Is that true that even though the dullahammer head was that leveled up, only little damage is being dealt? I unfortunately have not had the time to test this. Did some testing on Nightmare in the glacial tomb with R7/G9 level 1 Dullahead using my boss guide file, only INT gear was coronation gown and rainbow scarf, rest of my build was a luck build, books were luck tomes and tailwind, resulting in 27 total INT. I was getting 12 against G axe outsiders, 9 against tracers, 9 against ice elementals, 10 against simian cannons, and 7 against simians. Demon lords only took 1 per hit. So it depends on the enemy they used it against, but numbers that low should only be happening against enemies with resistances.
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Post by lai on Aug 9, 2019 17:00:24 GMT -6
This is going to be my last post on this thread because I have better things to spend my time on. Couple problems with this example. Welcome company along with any of the other things that got nerfed weren't on the level of Hellhound, the second thing is players wouldn't feel powerful so much a they would feel enemies were just pathetic in that scenario. The thrill of feeling powerful comes from the players feeling like they can vanquish threats with ease 10 hp monsters probably wouldn't feel very threatening even if the player wasn't OP The 9/9 hellhound thing has nothing to do with Bloodstained outside of being a point of reference for us both to understand and a bit of hyperbole. I could've replaced it with "perma shield rod alucard shield combo", raised the hp number, and my point would remain the same. It was used to compare your claim that games sell well because it gives the of feeling OP which disregards things like marketing, legacy, and genre which can be argued to have a much bigger impact on a game's sales aka the thing I actually wrote about in that post. SOTN sold over a million but that is not very impressive compared to the best selling games of all time, it doesn't even come close. Anyway, sequels getting easier than their previous installments has been a thing since difficulty padding was phased out of popular design in order to keep the newer entries accessible to newcomers, this doesn't just apply to top sellers, but countless smaller series. But it does not always result in higher sales just look at Dead Space or the portable Castlevanias (Circle of the Moon outsold Aria of Sorrow despite being the harder game). You've elaborated and lost me bit. Soul Steal and WC are different tools in different games, you're comparing apples to oranges here. Yes Bloodstained follows a lot of the same design philosophy as SOTN, but there's 2 decades of evolution between them and in those two decades lots of things have changed. Mechanics have changed, enemy design. WC serves as damage and protection from Dullahammer Heads and is an equip-able. Soul Steal appears to be designed as a room clearer from its inception and can be used whenever you want as long as you know the input and have the mp. The balance of power and context of their use are completely different. Also in a game like this you can die at any point, WC being active does not change that, people can die with Directed Shield out. If you've read the post I linked in my first post on this thread then you should already know I think the Velar nerf was unwarranted so I'll just say I agree with you there. Also I play on PC, yes I did use it a bit before the nerfs for testing purposes, and yes I still believe it warranted a nerf albeit not one as extreme as we got. Ok? And? You took damage because you mis-spaced, that's hardly the shard's fault and I don't see what losing portraits have to do with anything outside of the shards mechanics. What if I have a video of me using the nerfed WC but I go through an entire corridor without getting hit? What does that prove? Absolutely nothing. You can make anything look bad or good with enough effort. Besides the issue I have with WC is not in the endgame, but with the early-midgame when you get it and where it over-centralizes playthroughs for casual players. _____________________________________________ Yes we are required to solve all puzzles with the same gear and in the same manner except these are only at very specific points in the game, you do not need to use the puzzle solving tools outside of it. Using the same gear for a few minutes for a few puzzles or roadblocks is not the same as spending 75% or more of your time playing using with the exact same loadout. I do not believe that a meta of a few slightly stronger weapons is wrong and I never stated otherwise. In the context of casual play, the problem arises when the meta gear unconsciously overrides the player's choice and effectively railroads them into using them. They won't be finding a way around it because to a casual player the way around it potentially results in a game too hard for them to beat as they are used to the style the tool demands and the crutch it provides. If the player had been using the style they preferred the difficulty would be fine, but since they were forced into the meta style they don't have the time or chance to switch, and I highly doubt most casual players will invest the time to learn two different playstyles. Please read my post more carefully as I have already addressed these points.
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Post by lai on Aug 8, 2019 13:16:42 GMT -6
In sum, the game really isn't particularly easy (or any easier than other games in the genre played on normal mode), and the skills they've targeted are odd, as I consider them average skills, by far not the strongest. However, I've acknowledged there is some merit to what Purifyweirdshard mentioned, which is that the goal is simply to encourage experimentation. I think it's a somewhat futile goal, as casual gamers are always going to default to "easy and convenient" skills, but certainly I can appreciate the argument. I don't believe it is as futile as you make it out to be. You mentioned not using them due to them clashing with your playstyle, and they clash with mine too, to the extent that the statistical advantage granted isn't enough to outweigh the effort needed in the shift (in my case, I won't presume yours). However, while casual gamers, and all players to an extent, gravitate to the "easy and convenient" skills, those criteria shift from player to player even if they aren't consciously aware of them. I've always played my games more slowly/cautiously than most and I have a friend that can be charitably described as a "24/7 Leeroy Jenkins" when he plays games. Our definitions of easy and convenient differ and there's nothing wrong with that. Problems arise when convenience in raw power outweighs all other criteria which results in a large majority of players playing the exact same way, using the exact same tools, regardless of their preferences. This is a problem more pronounced in multiplayer games because it quickly becomes obvious due to constant player-t0-player interaction, but it still exists in certain single-player games, like Bloodstained, and one deserving of attention because these "gravitating builds/tools" will usually result in less engaging/entertaining experience for those who would have otherwise have chosen a different playstyle. You could argue that nerfs to the gravitating tools come at the cost of the enjoyment of those who are naturally drawn towards them and you'd be right. It's a balancing act that ultimately depends on what the developer wants out of their game and there is no right answer, just a giant spectrum of possibilities. This turned out longer than I expected but when I read that I just had to get this down.
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Post by lai on Aug 8, 2019 2:24:42 GMT -6
Seta I have a feeling you're missing the main point of what I was trying to say (or maybe I presented it poorly), but for now I'll respond to these points and elaborate later since I need to sleep. EDIT: Elaborated Do not mistake will for apathy. I called it a choice because I knew it existed, but I didn't care to use them so I made the decision not to. And I never claimed otherwise, but there exists a theoretical point where a game is too easy for everyone. Whether they know it or not everyone has a minimum difficulty they are willing to stomach. That list is a false equivalence and correlation vs causation problem if I ever saw one. While yes, all of the best selling games can be considered "easy" but it would be wrong to say that GTAV sold as well as it did simply because it was easy when there are dozens of factors to consider, same with Minecraft. Yes GTAV can be considered an easy game that sold well, but it also had a marketing machine bigger than the GDP of some countries and a long established legacy to roll off of. Minecraft can be considered easy, but it also unintentionally exploited the Youtube algorithm on a scale that wasn't seen again until Fortnite which is a small thing until you remember that Youtube is one of the most visited websites in existence. FF7 sold 11 million copies on the PS1, but it also had a plot twist to rival Darth Vader being Luke's father to drive word of mouth in a pre-mass-internet age, coupled with strong visuals, sound, and story. Now let's get into your second list "popular games." Yes SOTN is remembered for being easy and hammy voice acting, but it's also remembered for inventing and codifying an entire sub-genre. When SOTN is brought up in discussions more people will generally bring up the latter point unless a series entry point is being referred to. Skyrim is popular, yes it might be because it is easy but it could also be because it, like GTAV, had a pre-established legacy, a marketing machine that could make Cthulhu shudder, and, unlike GTAV, it has been re-released on basically everything that isn't mobile phones and is moddable on pc for extra longevity. I won't speak for Chrono-Trigger's difficulty as I don't know enough about it but from some Wikipedia browsing it is known for, game design, sound design, story, and visuals. If I made a game that essentially gave players 9/9 hellhound with the mana cost of flame canon right from the beginning and plopped them in a world full of big, threatening-looking enemies with 10 hp, I highly doubt it would become a best seller despite making people "feel powerful." There are many factors to a game's success: genre, marketing, legacy, design, visuals, presentation, trends, etc. Yes difficulty and "feeling powerful" can be considered one of those factors, but if it was the only factor I highly doubt Dark Souls would have ever sold more than a million. This one's on me, that point about it not affecting everyone was a response to your blanket claim because these nerfs don't affect everyone if I had decided to just play through the game once it certainly wouldn't have affected me or anyone who went through the game in a similar manner. As for the latter half of that sentence, it is a sort of shrodinger's cat / jcpenny effect scenario if someone never uses it in the first place could it be considered a chance? What if someone buys the game a year from now? And even if they do use the OP tool at its best, is that a guarantee it results in a better experience for the player? What if their playstyle is antithetical to the OP tool and using it is less fun for them, but they aren't skilled enough to switch to something that better suits them? Is a balanced game considered better than an unbalanced one? There's no right answer here as it will vary from person to person and it all depends on personal opinion.
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Post by lai on Aug 7, 2019 20:51:13 GMT -6
I like being OP, during the endgame, but I want to struggle in the path up to that so what do I answer? A lot of nuances are missing here. I've already made my reasons for being supportive of the nerfs here and I won't needlessly repeat myself. That's why they are options Like you stated in your post, you decided not to use them Basically they are there for people who want instant gratification versus nerfs that just effect everyone across the board I'm assuming you are referring and replying to my linked post here. I said I'm not going to talk on this matter anymore but your gross oversimplifications just spurred something in me. I've been meaning to get these words out anyway so thanks for this chance. These OP tools are being nerfed for the casual player. These nerfs do not effect people who never used them in the first place and have the potential to make the game more enjoyable for the casual player. To begin, it is less I didn't choose the use them it's more I didn't bother equipping them in the first place during my first playthrough (this was release day and I wanted to get to the ending before going to sleep). In later playthroughs it was my choice not to use them but for my first it was ignorance so the nerfs don't affect everyone. I think I would have had a much lower opinion of Bloodstained if I did use WC, Bunny, and Dullaheads because I'm a player that naturally seeks a challenge and if that challenge just vanishes the instant I get one of those shards my enjoyment and, more importantly, engagement plummets. This is why I prefer NG over NG+ playthroughs, NG+ just puts me to sleep. Something that a lot of people don't think about is that an easy game can also feel dull and forgettable which is probably the worst legacy a game can have. While my bar of "this game is too easy to be fun" is definitely more difficult that what many other people's are, this bar exists for everyone and if a game's difficulty goes below this bar, the game is no longer engaging and thus not worth playing for most people. However, these OP items are not there for people's immediate gratification, they are there as tools every player eventually stumbles upon. Unfortunately, a lot of the OP tools are extremely easy to get. You do not have to go out of your way to get Welcome Company, in fact it is mathematically improbable you go through the game and not get it unless you are skipping enemies. Bunny is missable but the first time you're on the train you have Zangetsu to get you the shard for doing absolutely nothing but going to the right. There's nothing wrong with getting power for natural or minimal progression and/or effort, but there's a problem in the balance when you get them without even trying to and they are better than everything else to the extent they invalidate every piece of equipment from that point onward. What these nerfs try to accomplish is to knock these things down to something closer to the level of everything else around them (with a few confusing exceptions), they're still strong, all shards are in their own way, but not so strong that you reach the peak of power in the first third of the game. This allows room for the player to grow and for the game's difficulty to not drop like a rock.
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Post by lai on Aug 7, 2019 16:46:14 GMT -6
I feel that this is a loaded question (as in you own the dealer, judge, broadcast, and ref type of loaded) and it misses the reason behind the nerfs. Barely anyone is going to answer no unless they fall within some rather specific categories. The question is also just plain worded badly. I like being OP, during the endgame, but I want to struggle in the path up to that so what do I answer? A lot of nuances are missing here. I've already made my reasons for being supportive of the nerfs here and I won't needlessly repeat myself.
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Post by lai on Aug 6, 2019 17:44:33 GMT -6
5 times.
First was on normal. Then it was NG+ hard and nightmare. Followed by 2 NG nightmare runs and preparing to do a shardless nightmare NG playthrough.
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September 2015
lai
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Post by lai on Aug 6, 2019 2:42:03 GMT -6
That was great! But why don't you use Shortcuts to change weapons? Shortcuts are unlocked after the first Zangetsu fight so I can't use them for him and Vepar. For the rest, it is because I felt that I didn't need to switch weapons during the fight so I just stuck with the weapon I entered the fight with.
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lai
Loyal Familiar
Professional lurker and OOE expert
Posts: 107
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743
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May 4, 2024 2:54:23 GMT -6
86
lai
Professional lurker and OOE expert
107
Sept 7, 2015 18:56:30 GMT -6
September 2015
lai
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Post by lai on Aug 5, 2019 15:52:52 GMT -6
RIP uber-Valefor you will be missed. Updated Valefor's entry to account for his now 9999 capped hp. I'll leave the current video up though as I didn't notice any other major changes in the fight. Still investigating Gremory and Orobas for noticeable changes. If you know what they are, please let me know.
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lai
Loyal Familiar
Professional lurker and OOE expert
Posts: 107
inherit
743
0
May 4, 2024 2:54:23 GMT -6
86
lai
Professional lurker and OOE expert
107
Sept 7, 2015 18:56:30 GMT -6
September 2015
lai
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Post by lai on Aug 5, 2019 0:09:01 GMT -6
Rixuel Because the real Miriam would not have that quote in her mind. Your enemy search is very helpful, I was thinking how did I get the Rhava Bural from EBBenjy The problem is, she did not hope that, I know her she's my friend lai I doubt that, but I forgive whoever responsible for making that quote, and the unreal Miriam only lasted for a few seconds anyway Instead, she would possibly think something like this "(The food looks tasty, maybe I should get one for myself".) Knowing this game is made with Unreal Engine, I double forgive that I think I finally get what you mean by unreal. I believe you are trying to say that "This line is out of character for Miriam and/or somewhat out of place given that it is the only one of its type." If I'm wrong then I'll need you to fully explain to me what you in what way Miriam is unreal here (outside of the game engine). I feel the current line is fine and in-line with who Miriam is given that she's a bit malnourished at the beginning of the game. It's short, comedic, and it doesn't violate what's established about her. IDK what the line is in Japanese but unless there's been a major translation change it is safe to say there's nothing out-of-character about it.
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lai
Loyal Familiar
Professional lurker and OOE expert
Posts: 107
inherit
743
0
May 4, 2024 2:54:23 GMT -6
86
lai
Professional lurker and OOE expert
107
Sept 7, 2015 18:56:30 GMT -6
September 2015
lai
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Post by lai on Aug 4, 2019 14:48:53 GMT -6
It represents Miriam's internal thoughts and commentary. She wants to eat some of the food she just gave that elderly blackhole but is too polite to say it outright. I don't get what's unreal about it.
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