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Post by Aztec on Nov 6, 2019 12:26:41 GMT -6
So I'm wondering...what really happened? It seems like they made the game with UE4 for PC, and hoped that UE4 would just automatically port it over to the other systems? I can assure you no one in the development team thought anything would happen “automatically”. The UE4 is not magic but what it does is make the porting between UE4-supported platforms a lot easier (but far from “automatic”), especially when it’s between PC/Xbox/PS4. It’s the Switch’s lower specs that cause the additional headaches and some handle the downporting better (Square with Dragon Quest XI’s amazing Switch port, also an UE4 game) than others (Bloodstained RotN).
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Post by dareka on Nov 6, 2019 16:32:18 GMT -6
It’s the Switch’s lower specs that cause the additional headaches and some handle the downporting better (Square with Dragon Quest XI’s amazing Switch port, also an UE4 game) than others (Bloodstained RotN). Right. To be fair, though, how well a port is handled is often directly proportional to how much money is spent on it...and IGA never had cash to burn. Should have cancelled or delayed the Switch port, though. That's what I think would have been best for the long-term success of the brand, even if profits did fall in the short term.
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Post by Dragon_of_Dojima on Nov 6, 2019 22:22:37 GMT -6
I think following in MN9's footsteps with stretch goal ports was a horrible idea to begin with. You have a slated developer who claims they can get UE4 working on Vita and Wii U...that's already a lofty goal as it is but now we don't see that developer at all anymore. They skipped town like they were skipping alimony payments. I mean that sort of wizardry is probably possible but would fall under miracle tech genius like the studio Panic Button. Wolfenstein 2...AND Doom(different engine, I'm well aware) on Switch and they look amazing and run pretty well too. I mean at the end of the day, it's the carpenter and not the tools. Any engine, even with its limitations or faults can accomplish great things. I was under the impression for a while that UE4 and Switch will never get along, but then I saw Dragon Ball: FighterZ run on it, I saw Yooka Laylee 2 run on it, Yoshi ran pretty well on it too. Even the best carpenter can fail if they don't have a solid plan. A straight port was a mistake and I knew the minute I heard that the Switch port would only be delayed by a month or less that it would be a disaster. The plan should have been computers first, then PS4/XBOX later, then everything else. Sure more people would have waited, but a more stable product would come of this. But hey, I'm just an observer. You guys are the experts. So I say once again, good luck.
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Post by pabloam on Nov 7, 2019 6:19:31 GMT -6
Good news for Switch version! Thanks for this update! Maybe, PJ needs an improvement related with textures and it could be a perfect version! (Year edition for 2020 with all these updates and all DLCs in the same cartdrige??)
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Post by ovenkitty on Nov 7, 2019 8:58:07 GMT -6
i want the rain effects for the ship added for the switch version of bloodstained: ritual of the night. when is the DLC going to be released? I want Tower of Twin Dragons and desert fixed for the Switch version, graphics, loading times, optimization and everything all fixed in 1.04 for switch version. You're probably never going to see those rain effects added. It's not an over-sight, they were absent from the initial release to improve performance. I don't think there's any way of adding those water effects without significant lag/fps drops.
As for v1.04, I doubt everythings going to be fixed by then.
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Post by Seta on Nov 7, 2019 15:33:58 GMT -6
How does the ETA for Xbox being able to buy the iga pack go from being "the end of August" to "the end of September" then to "no information on when the update will be available" Heck, i'd gladly give up rain effects if it meant being able to buy and gift the iga pack now
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Post by browren on Nov 7, 2019 21:11:08 GMT -6
So I'm wondering...what really happened? It seems like they made the game with UE4 for PC, and hoped that UE4 would just automatically port it over to the other systems? That is EXACTLY what happened. Focus on UE4 on PC, do a tiny bit of testing on PS4, a tiny tiny bit of testing on Xbox, and then blow the rest off until the end of last year, try to just switch the targets and realize there was a big, big problem on their most profitable target (retail Switch sales). We know 505 was spending its own money on development and the kickstarter cash was all gone, so they needed to get the game out and selling ASAP, and needed to start throwing stuff off the train to get it done. So, looking at likely post-release retail sales, the first obvious cuts were Linux and Mac. There wasn't anything actually wrong with those, but they weren't going to bring in Switch or Windows PC sales numbers, so management didn't care too much if they got dropped. The people meant to work on the cancelled platforms were thrown at the Switch version, but of course, it wasn't nearly enough and 505 chose to ship a game that runs at 15fps on the Switch with an IOU for a better framerate. (and a bunch of IOUs for additional content, but whatever). It's a business story as old as time - the developers overpromise, underperform, and then the business managers show up and lie through their teeth to make sure the dollars still roll in. Rush the release out, lie to the consumers, and then beg for forgiveness after release day, while walking off with bags of money. Oh well. It's kind of sad that the game runs on a cancelled platform a hell of a lot better than it ever will on 505's golden goose. I've heard the Switch can run Ubuntu - maybe they should just try that instead ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Post by yulan on Nov 11, 2019 10:22:56 GMT -6
. . .
Oh I forgot the most important thing, where is Update#99? I can't find it anywhere, I suppose it doesn't exist, and why there's no Update#99?
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Nov 11, 2019 11:20:53 GMT -6
yulan #99 is on the Kickstarter page with the rest of them. It just wasn't posted here because it's something more specific to Japan. Update 99 about Yamane's concertThe Kickstarter site is the original area for the news, rather than here.
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Post by browren on Nov 12, 2019 10:22:28 GMT -6
At least they should have warn people about the unique condition of Switch Giving consumers any indication that they're getting a substandard port is the second-to-last thing 505 will ever do (the last being admitting that they lied about Mac/Linux). They'll blame everyone else first, again, like they did with Mac/Linux, and say it's UE4, or the Switch's hardware spec, or maybe they could trot out the ol' middleware red herring.
It's because the developers waited until the last minute and then started working on ports, rather than doing it all in parallel like they should have. The Switch version performs badly because of bad dev planning, backed up by dishonest business management, and it will cost them a lot more than they "saved" by cheating, because all of those customers are going to see the 505 label on other games and think of how they got scammed on Bloodstained.
Hell, just with me it's already cost them several full-retail purchases, including games with native Linux versions. Death Stranding, Control, Indivisible - I would have bought release day and for the Windows games, worked with the Proton devs to make them run on Linux (which means more sales...)
505 used to be one of my favorite publishers and I was quite happy when they first picked up Bloodstained, but now I'll never buy from them again.
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Nov 12, 2019 10:46:29 GMT -6
I believe I've said it before, but I know for a fact that the middleware problem was real. I'm not able to tell you what it was specifically, but it wasn't a lie.
It's common knowledge that the Switch doesn't run games as well as consoles or PC. Letting the customers know that it's "meant to be different" is unnecessary. That said, it is agreed by all including them that it should have been released in a better state, and hopefully after the most recent patch + the next, it will be in a state more can agree is acceptable.
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Post by browren on Nov 12, 2019 12:55:33 GMT -6
Oh I'm sure there were many problems, all code has bugs, but I'd bet you a Switch Lite that it wasn't nearly as actually bad as "game runs at 15FPS with GPU maxed out."
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Post by rav4ishing on Nov 13, 2019 11:32:22 GMT -6
So I'm wondering...what really happened? It seems like they made the game with UE4 for PC, and hoped that UE4 would just automatically port it over to the other systems? I can assure you no one in the development team thought anything would happen “automatically”. The UE4 is not magic but what it does is make the porting between UE4-supported platforms a lot easier (but far from “automatic”), especially when it’s between PC/Xbox/PS4. It’s the Switch’s lower specs that cause the additional headaches and some handle the downporting better (Square with Dragon Quest XI’s amazing Switch port, also an UE4 game) than others (Bloodstained RotN). Curious...do what you have firsthand knowledge? BTW, I was more so referring to management, not developers.
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Post by Aztec on Nov 13, 2019 13:52:48 GMT -6
I can assure you no one in the development team thought anything would happen “automatically”. The UE4 is not magic but what it does is make the porting between UE4-supported platforms a lot easier (but far from “automatic”), especially when it’s between PC/Xbox/PS4. It’s the Switch’s lower specs that cause the additional headaches and some handle the downporting better (Square with Dragon Quest XI’s amazing Switch port, also an UE4 game) than others (Bloodstained RotN). Curious...do what you have firsthand knowledge? BTW, I was more so referring to management, not developers. No but I’ve been around and talked to/read about developers enough to know that nothing in game development is “automatic”. Some tools have helped make processes easier but this narrative about “developers being lazy” is arrogant, despicable, and plainly untrue. The Switch version was subpar because of a lack of time, resources, and probably lack of familiarity with the still new Switch hardware, the UE4 engine or both. Not because they were lazy expecting UE4 to make the porting for them and call it a day!
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Post by rav4ishing on Nov 13, 2019 22:32:28 GMT -6
Curious...do what you have firsthand knowledge? BTW, I was more so referring to management, not developers. No but I’ve been around and talked to/read about developers enough to know that nothing in game development is “automatic”. Some tools have helped make processes easier but this narrative about “developers being lazy” is arrogant, despicable, and plainly untrue. The Switch version was subpar because of a lack of time, resources, and probably lack of familiarity with the still new Switch hardware, the UE4 engine or both. Not because they were lazy expecting UE4 to make the porting for them and call it a day! Hence I put the caveat about management and not developers. I also never called out developers to begin with.
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Post by tony on Nov 19, 2019 4:57:56 GMT -6
Would the team be willing to offer download codes for other versions to Switch owners? I usually stick to PC but I thought portability would be fun for this game, and it crashes reliably any time I use the dock. It's fundamentally broken and, after losing hours of save data to crashes I'm going to cut my losses and stop playing on Switch. I would really prefer not having to buy the game twice, as good as it is.
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Post by Seta on Nov 19, 2019 4:58:20 GMT -6
Xbox ETA for the iga pack is the 29th
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Post by sylver on Nov 22, 2019 2:40:28 GMT -6
AztecThis ist a point where I would like to bring in Ori. Ori plays ways better on Switch, compared to the system,that it was originaly exclussive to.
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Post by Aztec on Nov 22, 2019 5:09:28 GMT -6
AztecThis ist a point where I would like to bring in Ori. Ori plays ways better on Switch, compared to the system,that it was originaly exclussive to. Ori plays better on Switch than Bloodstained on Switch does but Ori Switch doesn’t play better than Ori on Xbox, c’mon now. Also Ori, as fantastic as it is, isn’t as taxing on hardware as Bloodstained is.
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Post by sylver on Nov 22, 2019 10:50:18 GMT -6
Aztec Well, there aren't worlds between, but (IMHO) it's still much better on Switch. However, since it's a game based on the hole Metroidvania mechanic, not unlike our beloved IGAvania, I think that Bloodstained has the potential to be another Ori.. they only need skilled and experienced programmers.
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