gunlord500
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Hyped for Bloodstained 2!
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Post by gunlord500 on Dec 1, 2018 15:35:45 GMT -6
Yeah, I'm with Pure Miriam and Astaroth. As I was talking to my friends about, I'd wager Wayforward presence means the game is further along than we might expect. If they're bringing on Wayforward for bug testing and polish, it means they have a lot of systems and assets created, because you can't bug test game elements or polish graphics that don't exist.  |
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Post by Question on Dec 4, 2018 13:55:40 GMT -6
Really neutral for this update. For every positive thing I can think of there's a negative. I don't know if I am happy because this hopefully means the work will be faster now or worried because they had to "hire" an additional team to help this late in the process. I'm glad everyone here is optimistic but I'm just not sure. As for Wayforward's actual input, it would be a waste to only hire them for bug fixes and polishing but at the same time I kinda don't want them to do things "from scratch" if that would mean additional time in development. Finally, I am mixed on Wayforward as a whole because they made some games I adored (Contra 4, Ducktales Remastered even if that had a foundation already) but I don't share the ultra positive opinion on other games they did (Shantae and The Mummy Demastered were good games but that'it IMO, and I really didn't like Half Genie Hero). Though I will say one more thing: I don't really love the vagueness of the update. The game should be basically finished with polishing to do (if anything, VAs have finished recording their lines), so if they tell me they hired another team AT THIS POINT I would like to know exactly what that team will do. Bug fixes and polishing exclusively or working on some modes? Heh I really would like more details. I totally undertand the sentiment of anyone that is feeling less than awesome during this time. We have been lean on updates, but that will change once we announce the release date. To answer some of your specific comments: It be more worrisome to need help and not ask for it. WF isn't working on the game 'from scratch', they are supporting the development team. While you may not have liked other WF games, it shouldn't be an issue. The the look, feel and design of RotN is purely IGA. WF are supporting IGAs vision, not designing from scratch. Primarily WF is working on bug fixes and polish, but I'm sure if they are needed for something else they will handle it. I doubt we'll get too detailed on the day-to-day of their involvement. |
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Post by Galamoth on Dec 4, 2018 14:51:37 GMT -6
Primarily WF is working on bug fixes and polish, but I'm sure if they are needed for something else they will handle it. I doubt we'll get too detailed on the day-to-day of their involvement. It's probably way too late at this point in the game's development to ask this question, but while you're here, I'd like to know if IGA and the development team have considered the possibility of WayForward helping with Classic Mode and/or the " Retro Level"? Speaking of the latter, do you know if the Retro Level (the $2,250,000 stretch goal) is still planned as a separate feature in RotN at this point? I've personally been confused about that, as to whether it's supposed to be a secret area in Gebel's Castle, or if it was just a predecessor to certain stretch goals like Classic Mode or the "Prequel Mini-Game"/"Retro Spin-Off" (Curse of the Moon). |
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Dec 4, 2018 15:06:29 GMT -6
I don't think any of the stretch goals supplant the other ones; if so, that would have necessitated stating so.
I have a baseline assumption that Angel saying WayForward is helping with other "large" things to come could mean said stretch goals, or perhaps something else entirely...or maybe even just relate to something non-game. But yeah.
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Post by Question on Dec 4, 2018 16:04:43 GMT -6
Primarily WF is working on bug fixes and polish, but I'm sure if they are needed for something else they will handle it. I doubt we'll get too detailed on the day-to-day of their involvement. It's probably way too late at this point in the game's development to ask this question, but while you're here, I'd like to know if IGA and the development team have considered the possibility of WayForward helping with Classic Mode and/or the " Retro Level"? Speaking of the latter, do you know if the Retro Level (the $2,250,000 stretch goal) is still planned as a separate feature in RotN at this point? I've personally been confused about that, as to whether it's supposed to be a secret area in Gebel's Castle, or if it was just a predecessor to certain stretch goals like Classic Mode or the "Prequel Mini-Game"/"Retro Spin-Off" (Curse of the Moon). Most of these questions will get answered with the launch date announcement. |
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Post by freddythemonkey on Dec 5, 2018 15:28:07 GMT -6
Clarifications are much appreciated. I do think that in this delicate phase updates should be as exhaustive and clear as possible. Perhaps there are backers who aren't in the forums/aren't that active on the Internet who may share my concerns and they would hardly get a chance to see the staff's clarifications, so even the "boring" stuff should be pretty exhaustive to preemptively explain some concerns, if that's possible.
At least that's my sentiment.
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Post by HylianMetroid96 on Dec 6, 2018 13:28:20 GMT -6
Okay, what IS the Classic Mode and the "Retro Level"? The retro level turned into Curse of the Moon. Classic Mode is what though? I remember hearing it was simply a Linear set level that plays out like a Linear Castlevania title....which would be a moot point considering Curse of the Moon already fills that role. A more pixelated, 16/32-bit style that plays more like the main game just graphical style difference would make all the more sense.
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Dec 6, 2018 13:37:36 GMT -6
Okay, what IS the Classic Mode and the "Retro Level"? The retro level turned into Curse of the Moon. Classic Mode is what though? I remember hearing it was simply a Linear set level that plays out like a Linear Castlevania title....which would be a moot point considering Curse of the Moon already fills that role. A more pixelated, 16/32-bit style that plays more like the main game just graphical style difference would make all the more sense. It did not turn into Curse of the Moon, by any official statement. This is all addressed in the faq I put up as the last question in section 1, "stretch goal confusion" bloodstained.forums.net/thread/2143/bloodstained-faqs-miscWhen the retro level was introduced, they noted that a "full 8-bit game doesn't fit into the budget", and later the "mini" game of CotM was made into a goal, but that doesn't by itself mean or indicate that CotM supplanted the retro level. The intention at that time, too, was not that it would be a "full" game, even though it basically ended up being that. It's not impossible they could come out and tell us that the level became CotM, but that'd be new information. |
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Astaroth
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Post by Astaroth on Dec 7, 2018 10:47:59 GMT -6
retro level could be like the silenced ruins in dos, although more warped by space/time by the inhabitants instead of "oh holy crap thats a cool callback to cv1"
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Post by Saint Germain on Dec 7, 2018 12:09:30 GMT -6
I really hope sony's new policy does not effect the game.
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Post by Galamoth on Dec 7, 2018 17:30:57 GMT -6
I really hope sony's new policy does not effect the game. ? |
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Post by Pure Miriam on Dec 9, 2018 2:02:54 GMT -6
Regarding the confusion between Retro Level, Classic Mode and Mini game.
From what i remember / read / saw:
MINI GAME: A retro-style mini-game that would work out as a prequel to the main game. The prequel part was dropped (IGA decision) and the game became a spin-off.
RETRO LEVEL: A retro-style area inside the main game (most probably inside Gebel Castle), that makes a callback to the old times of gaming. It may be a specific area rendered in pixelated and/or 8-bit fashion or simply an area that looks and feels old-school.
CLASSIC MODE: A mode where you can play some punishing stages with limited gameplay like the old sidescroller games of the past, using the game's graphics. (So, it is retro in gameplay, not in looks).
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Post by Yän on Dec 9, 2018 5:45:14 GMT -6
I really hope sony's new policy does not effect the game. If you're talking about the censorship policy regarding sexual content, I don't see why it should affect the game. Bloodstained is not a game like that, right? Castlevania games have never been sexually explicit as far as I can remember. Why should that be different for Bloodstained? |
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Dec 10, 2018 11:50:10 GMT -6
Pure Miriam that's pretty much exactly right. Those descriptions match the official ones. If someone's still interested and didn't see the FAQ post I mentioned, I'll quote that here:
Q: I'm confused about all of these stretch goal modes. What will be in 2D? What is Classic Mode exactly?
A: Most of the modes and also stretch goals we earned are detailed in the list of "Milestones" on the main campaign page (see link at start of this post), but not everything is mentioned, such as the Retro Level.
There has been some confusion over what each piece of content entails, so to detail the specifics of the Retro Level, Classic Mode and prequel mini-game please see the below excerpts from their respective Kickstarter updates:
Update 2 (Retro Level)
"Now that you have the Crystal Lens, you can see that coming up at $2.25 million is… a Retro Level! Here’s an explanation from the developers:
One section of the castle will feature an area that Miriam can traverse in beautiful retro graphics. We've been referring to this section as the “8-bit Level” internally, although it may be closer to 16+ bit depending on how we mix it with the full game. While a full-blown 8-bit game doesn't fit into the game's budget, backer support will allow us to have fun with the development and create a little retro magic in our game."
Update 3 (Classic Mode)
"Visible next in your Crystal Lens is one of our personal favorites: Classic Mode. This is a cool one, especially if you've been playing action platformers since controllers had two buttons: In Classic Mode, existing assets and screens from the game will be rearranged linearly, to reward timing and survival instead of backtracking and exploration.
IGA and company are still too early in the planning process to promise anything, but right now he's envisioning six punishing stages. In grand classic platformer fashion, you'll be weaker and the enemies will be stronger, and forget about saving yourself by grinding—no RPG elements here."
If you've always preferred your castles punishingly difficult, straightforward, and scrolling from left to right, this is the stretch goal for you.
Update 18 (Prequel mini-game)
This became the non-prequel Bloodstained: Curse of the Moon.
curseofthemoon.com/en
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Post by Saint Germain on Dec 11, 2018 11:32:12 GMT -6
GalamothI really hope sony's new policy does not effect the game. If you're talking about the censorship policy regarding sexual content, I don't see why it should affect the game. Bloodstained is not a game like that, right? Castlevania games have never been sexually explicit as far as I can remember. Why should that be different for Bloodstained? True but their has been slight nudity in past games. Plus let's not forget  still probably nothing will be effected hopefully.
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Post by Galamoth on Dec 11, 2018 11:55:12 GMT -6
I don't think is going to be changed anymore than he already has been, 'cuz the change it did go through was according to IGA's artistic vision. |
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Post by Saint Germain on Dec 11, 2018 12:05:18 GMT -6
Yeah I trust Iga to fight for his artistic vision, he is great at making gothic interesting stories.
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Post by Pure Miriam on Dec 12, 2018 1:51:10 GMT -6
To be fair, i don't see any true censorship yet and i was fearful of that too, but i changed my opinion when i realized what they really did. Talking about Vepar, the creature is still nude, her breasts are still fully visible AND she has NIPPLES now, something she didn't in the past. They most probably reduced their sized to look less "goofy". They could had mainained the same size, but some people actually considers she looks "more sexy" (for a ship-breaking sea monster, that is). Miriam herself. She was thinner on the artworks and when they rendered her, they blatantly made her more "thick", thicker thighs, bigger breasts and such. If we really go deep into it, i would say they actually made the whole game sexier than it was before. On my thread about what Bloodstained was and what it is ( HERE) i have two pictures that shows that:  Anyone can see that they made Miriam "thicker" and more big breasted.  If you pay attention (this picture is a bit hard to see, but it is there) you can see that Vepar has nipples now. |
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Post by akahige on Dec 15, 2018 10:53:12 GMT -6
I'm afraid with all the love for wayforward (love that began much earlier than the hype started, as I actually imported the first GBC Shantae at release; luckily for my wallet!), I too got an alarming bad vibe from this update.
freddythemonkey is right about the "vagueness" of it. We got in a row 1) a major delay from 2018 to 2019; 2) the cancelation of Vita; all this was supposed to be to iron out some fine detail due to concerns expressed here. I mean... if one concern is "lips synching during cutscenes" surely this means you're polishing the last fine details of a pretty much completed package?
But the "new hunter in the fray" was a cold shower to me. You don't hire an external at this stage of development. I mean... Suppose the game is 95% done, what does Wayforward come to address? Lip synching and background shaders? That's not realistic at all...
So yeah, when everyone did read the cool "new hunter in the fray" moniker, I just read the update a couple times and decided the correct titles was pretty much: "Update#75 - We admit it now: we're in development hell"
After asking forgiveness for the delay to 2019, you can't just churn out lively monthly updates with some monster concept art and random tidbits, as if nothing had happened. I don't think this is what fans are expecting to hear.
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Dec 15, 2018 17:15:37 GMT -6
Well, I know not everyone followed the beta developments as closely, but it had a -lot- of bugs. Unfortunately, I'd admit, an alarming number of them even. Under the weight of that as well as new eyes and hands to deliver the polish people wanted from the constructive feedback side of it, it makes sense to get some help to make all that happen. "Just fixing lip sync and some shaders" is a gross understatement of what they needed to work on. One example there is a huge thread we had here about what some were seeing as a graphical downgrade over the course of development, and whether true or not, is certainly not a perception that's good for people to have.
WF coming in is assurance that they care about doing these things, and doing them with efficiency enough to release the game when they've said. There's also the matter of there being so many modes that by all indications we've seen, are intended to be released with the main game at launch...somehow. Managing that itself with just a handful of indie guys who, while experienced, haven't shipped a game yet as a collective unit, sounded like a lot. It was a smart move. I could give the critique that perhaps it should have been done sooner, but I think it actually was, a bit - as in not long after the feedback was received, or even before that maybe unofficially. I saw this all the way back in April -
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still probably nothing will be effected hopefully. 
