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Post by ghaleon on Jul 13, 2015 9:44:29 GMT -6
Noee. The cuteness has already been sold.
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Post by LuckPercentSRL on Jul 13, 2015 9:45:17 GMT -6
Yeah. From the moment I saw Miriam for the first time, I thought it looked very much like Shanoa. And again, like Shanoa, she's has a plethora of ways to dish out the damage instead of just using her basic attack.
But I still prefer Charlotte Aulin from Portrait of Ruin sorry not sorry.
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Post by CastleDan on Jul 13, 2015 10:42:23 GMT -6
The Alucard similarities are there also.
Think of Gebel as Dracula, and think of Miriam as Alucard for a second.
Gebel wants Miriam to join him in the castle, it belongs to her.... but Miriam is out to stop Gebel from doing what he's doing. That's essentially the same idea in SOTN. Except in this game it isn't father and son it's two friends. She does this after being in some sorta sleep state just like Alucard ( though alucard's lasted for hundreds of years)... The curse has overtaken Gebel ( Dracula is full on vampire) whereas Miriam is only partially cursed ( whereas Alucard is half vampire)...
Boom.
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Post by Motoko on Jul 13, 2015 11:08:01 GMT -6
The Alucard similarities are there also. Think of Gebel as Dracula, and think of Miriam as Alucard for a second. Gebel wants Miriam to join him in the castle, it belongs to her.... but Miriam is out to stop Gebel from doing what he's doing. That's essentially the same idea in SOTN. Except in this game it isn't father and son it's two friends. She does this after being in some sorta sleep state just like Alucard ( though alucard's lasted for hundreds of years)... The curse has overtaken Gebel ( Dracula is full on vampire) whereas Miriam is only partially cursed ( whereas Alucard is half vampire)... Boom. Good catch. Also "Symphony of the night" and "Ritual of the night". It just makes sense when you take into account of what you wrote `(*∩_∩*)′
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緋月エリ
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Post by 緋月エリ on Jul 13, 2015 11:11:11 GMT -6
I personaly havnt played castlevania: Order of Ecclesia but in letsplay and wiki's I saw alot of similarities between these two heroins. I wonder anyone noticed (unless its been mentionend before then i do aplogize ) Shanoa is able to absorb Glyphs using the large rune on her back, which provide her with magical weapon abilities. Although she is often seen wielding an ethereal crimson-colored rapier, Shanoa can use any other weapons granted by her glyphs. Miriam Instead summons/use dark magic wich stains her skin with rose petals, but she also has runes on her body. the aura and petals also comes out from her back. Miriam also posses magical weapons and abilities, altho miriam uses swords like Shanoa, shanoa doesnt seem to use whips at all. There both dark haired.
There both emotioneless in terms of the drawings, im not sure if there personalities match since the game isnt even out yet.
The story seems to be somewhat the same yet in a difrent twist. I hope the story will be more complex an full of weird twist and suprises.
When I saw Miriam, I immediately thought "Shanoa, is that you!?" To be honest, Bloodstained feels like a reinvention of Order of Ecclesia. Though it would be cool if Miriam and Shanoa are sisters in some weird twisted dimension where Bloodstained and Castlevania meets.
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Post by Ciel on Jul 13, 2015 11:17:03 GMT -6
I personaly havnt played castlevania: Order of Ecclesia but in letsplay and wiki's I saw alot of similarities between these two heroins. I wonder anyone noticed (unless its been mentionend before then i do aplogize ) Shanoa is able to absorb Glyphs using the large rune on her back, which provide her with magical weapon abilities. Although she is often seen wielding an ethereal crimson-colored rapier, Shanoa can use any other weapons granted by her glyphs. Miriam Instead summons/use dark magic wich stains her skin with rose petals, but she also has runes on her body. the aura and petals also comes out from her back. Miriam also posses magical weapons and abilities, altho miriam uses swords like Shanoa, shanoa doesnt seem to use whips at all. There both dark haired.
There both emotioneless in terms of the drawings, im not sure if there personalities match since the game isnt even out yet.
The story seems to be somewhat the same yet in a difrent twist. I hope the story will be more complex an full of weird twist and suprises.
When I saw Miriam, I immediately thought "Shanoa, is that you!?" To be honest, Bloodstained feels like a reinvention of Order of Ecclesia. Though it would be cool if Miriam and Shanoa are sisters in some weird twisted dimension where Bloodstained and Castlevania meets. Maybe IGA was thinking about making a Castlevania which the female lead would be related to Shanoa and he reused the idea in Bloodstained.
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Post by 緋月エリ on Jul 13, 2015 11:22:30 GMT -6
When I saw Miriam, I immediately thought "Shanoa, is that you!?" To be honest, Bloodstained feels like a reinvention of Order of Ecclesia. Though it would be cool if Miriam and Shanoa are sisters in some weird twisted dimension where Bloodstained and Castlevania meets. Maybe IGA was thinking about making a Castlevania which the female lead would be related to Shanoa and he reused the idea in Bloodstained. That would be a Castlevania that I want to play! It will make for a great concept, too, because the world of Ecclesia hasn't been explored enough. The Belmonts/Alucard had tons of exposure, while Soma had two games of his own. It would be awesome if we could learn a little more about the time and place where Shanoa is from.
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Post by Arcueid Brunestud on Jul 13, 2015 11:29:52 GMT -6
Yeah, but Iga denies any relationship between Miriam and Shanoa. They're both similar because they're both strong female protagonists. Check one of the early posts where I posted a pic with Iga being interviewed about this.
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Post by 緋月エリ on Jul 13, 2015 11:51:55 GMT -6
Yeah, but Iga denies any relationship between Miriam and Shanoa. They're both similar because they're both strong female protagonists. Check one of the early posts where I posted a pic with Iga being interviewed about this. People just couldn't help but notice the similarities between the two characters though. For some reason IGA's vision of Miriam fell under the Shanoa category, even though they have different motivations. But, we will see once the game comes out, maybe they will be completely different characters in regards to personality and everything else!
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Post by crocodile on Jul 13, 2015 14:34:08 GMT -6
Yeah, but Iga denies any relationship between Miriam and Shanoa. They're both similar because they're both strong female protagonists. Check one of the early posts where I posted a pic with Iga being interviewed about this. As already covered by catastrophe, Miriam and Shanoa are too similar for it to be just a function "well they are both strong female leads". Considering, at least to my understanding, Shanoa was in part a tribute to/influenced by IGA's wife, its not exactly a shock that he would mine that well again - it means something to him. Granted, I thought Shanoa was one of the better characters in the Castlevania franchise so I'm not complaining (though to be honest I do like her character design more than Miriam's). I do hope Miriam gets to be a bit more expressive than Shanoa who had her emotions sealed away for most (or was it all) of the game.
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Post by Leo on Jan 10, 2016 14:24:55 GMT -6
Yeah, but Iga denies any relationship between Miriam and Shanoa. They're both similar because they're both strong female protagonists. Check one of the early posts where I posted a pic with Iga being interviewed about this. As already covered by catastrophe, Miriam and Shanoa are too similar for it to be just a function "well they are both strong female leads". Considering, at least to my understanding, Shanoa was in part a tribute to/influenced by IGA's wife, its not exactly a shock that he would mine that well again - it means something to him. Granted, I thought Shanoa was one of the better characters in the Castlevania franchise so I'm not complaining (though to be honest I do like her character design more than Miriam's). I do hope Miriam gets to be a bit more expressive than Shanoa who had her emotions sealed away for most (or was it all) of the game. well, she cries and smiles at the end vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/castlevania/images/4/43/Shanoa_smiling.JPG/revision/latest?cb=20090531015206
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Post by Valtiel on Jan 10, 2016 15:20:41 GMT -6
Yes, Miriam kinda sorta looks like Shanoa. Almost like Juste kind of looked like Alucard. And Soma kind of looked like Alucard. And Leon kind of looked like Alucard.
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Post by Scars Unseen on Jan 10, 2016 17:52:37 GMT -6
Nope. Not seeing it. Let's compare, shall we? Fortunately, we have official artwork showing them from the same perspective. Miriam has much softer features when compared to Shanoa. Rounder eyes, rounder nose, rounder cheeks, more arched eyebrows... There seems to have been a much more pronounced attempt to accentuate the feminine aspects of her appearance. Really, all they have in common is that they are pale(Miriam slightly more so) young women with dark hair and blue eyes who seem to like the color blue. The hair isn't even the same style. Any other similarities can be chalked up to having a similar influence in manga style artwork. I've seen manga and anime with more similar looking characters within the same title. They probably have less in common visually than two grizzled brown haired men from any two given FPS games.
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Galamoth
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Post by Galamoth on Jan 10, 2016 18:20:21 GMT -6
Nope. Not seeing it. Let's compare, shall we? Fortunately, we have official artwork showing them from the same perspective. Miriam has much softer features when compared to Shanoa. Rounder eyes, rounder nose, rounder cheeks, more arched eyebrows... There seems to have been a much more pronounced attempt to accentuate the feminine aspects of her appearance. Really, all they have in common is that they are pale(Miriam slightly more so) young women with dark hair and blue eyes who seem to like the color blue. The hair isn't even the same style. Any other similarities can be chalked up to having a similar influence in manga style artwork. I've seen manga and anime with more similar looking characters within the same title. They probably have less in common visually than two grizzled brown haired men from any two given FPS games. I don't suppose they really have to look too physically similar. There's plenty of differences between the two, but just enough similarities. I think Miriam actually has a stronger Ayami Kojima influence in her character-design than Shanoa, despite being originally designed by someone else [Yuji Natsume]. (I think he's the one. I could be wrong.) I was actually surprised to initially learn that Ayami Kojima was not responsible for the character designs in Order of Ecclesia. If you ask me, the OoE art-style didn't seem too "anime"-esque (though there are as many different manga/anime art-styles out there as there are mangakas, if not more). Though I think, as has been said before, that the main similarity that Shanoa & Miriam share is simply that they are strong female protagonists.
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Post by Reiji Mitsurugi on Jan 10, 2016 18:31:30 GMT -6
... Any other similarities can be chalked up to having a similar influence in manga style artwork. I've seen manga and anime with more similar looking characters within the same title. They probably have less in common visually than two grizzled brown haired men from any two given FPS games. Off-topic, but reminds me of Initial D, where was the seasons went on, far too many characters suffered from Takumization... the process by which previously visually-distinct characters become similar to main character Fujiwara Takumi, even females. XD On topic, I also don't see much in common between them. Our brains are very good pattern-making machines, we tend to see similarities and patterns even where they don't exist. Miriam has much more gentle, young features, similar to an early 20's woman. Shanoa on the other hand looks to be in her late 20's, witha much more mature look. Her costumes and hairstyles are completely different too.
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Post by BloodyTears92 on Jan 10, 2016 19:57:28 GMT -6
I noticed it almost instantly as well. I personally wondered if, given how frequently Shanoa appeared in the final years of the franchise, (Ecclesia, Judgment and Despair) she was a character IGA really wanted to explore but Konami canned him before he really got the chance; and if Miriam was perhaps his way of doing more with a character who's story was never allowed to really be expanded upon.
As for similarities when you get very specific yes they are different: Shanoa's hair is much longer, Miriam's face is rounder etc. But lets look at some broad strokes: 1. Both have large tattoos/marking on their backs and elsewhere on their bodies 2. Both wear outfits designed to reveal and emphasize said markings 3. Both wear outfits colored primarily blue and black 4. Both have amnesia, though Shanoa's is obviously more severe 5. Both character's stories involve fighting their former friends 6. Both characters are "Magic Knights" aka they can wield melee and magical powers with equal skill 7. Both use abilities taken in some fashion from the monsters they slay
I dont think its a huge stretch too see the pair as sharing more than a few things in common, though once we get the game the details, as well as Miriam's personality and how different she may or may not act will come to light.
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Post by Scars Unseen on Jan 10, 2016 20:06:05 GMT -6
I noticed it almost instantly as well. I personally wondered if, given how frequently Shanoa appeared in the final years of the franchise, (Ecclesia, Judgment and Despair) she was a character IGA really wanted to explore but Konami canned him before he really got the chance; and if Miriam was perhaps his way of doing more with a character who's story was never allowed to really be expanded upon. As for similarities when you get very specific yes they are different: Shanoa's hair is much longer, Miriam's face is rounder etc. But lets look at some broad strokes: 1. Both have large tattoos/marking on their backs and elsewhere on their bodies 2. Both wear outfits designed to reveal and emphasize said markings 3. Both wear outfits colored primarily blue and black 4. Both have amnesia, though Shanoa's is obviously more severe 5. Both character's stories involve fighting their former friends 6. Both characters are "Magic Knights" aka they can wield melee and magical powers with equal skill 7. Both use abilities taken in some fashion from the monsters they slay I dont think its a huge stretch too see the pair as sharing more than a few things in common, though once we get the game the details, as well as Miriam's personality and how different she may or may not act will come to light. Other than the appearance factors, of which there are more differences than similarities, most of that stuff can be counted as how Bloodstained is similar to Iga's Castlevania games more than anything specific to Shanoa. Almost every Castlevania character is a Magic Knight. Quite a lot of them involve fighting, if not friends, then former associates. Shanoa is hardly the first character to steal abilities from monsters. Pretty much all that leaves is amnesia, a *very* common trope in modern Japanese fiction. If Miriam was a male character, people would be claiming he was a Soma clone.
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Post by Galamoth on Jan 10, 2016 20:24:03 GMT -6
I noticed it almost instantly as well. I personally wondered if, given how frequently Shanoa appeared in the final years of the franchise, (Ecclesia, Judgment and Despair) she was a character IGA really wanted to explore but Konami canned him before he really got the chance; and if Miriam was perhaps his way of doing more with a character who's story was never allowed to really be expanded upon. As for similarities when you get very specific yes they are different: Shanoa's hair is much longer, Miriam's face is rounder etc. But lets look at some broad strokes: 1. Both have large tattoos/marking on their backs and elsewhere on their bodies 2. Both wear outfits designed to reveal and emphasize said markings 3. Both wear outfits colored primarily blue and black 4. Both have amnesia, though Shanoa's is obviously more severe 5. Both character's stories involve fighting their former friends 6. Both characters are "Magic Knights" aka they can wield melee and magical powers with equal skill 7. Both use abilities taken in some fashion from the monsters they slay I dont think its a huge stretch too see the pair as sharing more than a few things in common, though once we get the game the details, as well as Miriam's personality and how different she may or may not act will come to light. Other than the appearance factors, of which there are more differences than similarities, most of that stuff can be counted as how Bloodstained is similar to Iga's Castlevania games more than anything specific to Shanoa. Almost every Castlevania character is a Magic Knight. Quite a lot of them involve fighting, if not friends, then former associates. Shanoa is hardly the first character to steal abilities from monsters. Pretty much all that leaves is amnesia, a *very* common trope in modern Japanese fiction. If Miriam was a male character, people would be claiming he was a Soma clone. Depending on how exactly the character will play, I'm sure that people might claim Zangetsu to be a "Soma clone". Considering his "Ofuda" magic and sword, I think he may be more likely thought of as an "Alucard clone".
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Post by crocodile on Jan 10, 2016 20:31:37 GMT -6
I noticed it almost instantly as well. I personally wondered if, given how frequently Shanoa appeared in the final years of the franchise, (Ecclesia, Judgment and Despair) she was a character IGA really wanted to explore but Konami canned him before he really got the chance; and if Miriam was perhaps his way of doing more with a character who's story was never allowed to really be expanded upon. As for similarities when you get very specific yes they are different: Shanoa's hair is much longer, Miriam's face is rounder etc. But lets look at some broad strokes: 1. Both have large tattoos/marking on their backs and elsewhere on their bodies 2. Both wear outfits designed to reveal and emphasize said markings 3. Both wear outfits colored primarily blue and black 4. Both have amnesia, though Shanoa's is obviously more severe 5. Both character's stories involve fighting their former friends 6. Both characters are "Magic Knights" aka they can wield melee and magical powers with equal skill 7. Both use abilities taken in some fashion from the monsters they slay I dont think its a huge stretch too see the pair as sharing more than a few things in common, though once we get the game the details, as well as Miriam's personality and how different she may or may not act will come to light. Other than the appearance factors, of which there are more differences than similarities, most of that stuff can be counted as how Bloodstained is similar to Iga's Castlevania games more than anything specific to Shanoa. Almost every Castlevania character is a Magic Knight. Quite a lot of them involve fighting, if not friends, then former associates. Shanoa is hardly the first character to steal abilities from monsters. Pretty much all that leaves is amnesia, a *very* common trope in modern Japanese fiction. If Miriam was a male character, people would be claiming he was a Soma clone. You can take one element and say "oh this other character also does this" or "its just a common trope" but when you take them all together, I feel its pretty clear Miriam is most similar to Shanoa out of all Castlevania characters out there. I'd also say most Castlevania character AREN'T Magic Knights - that would only apply to Alucard, Soma, Shanoa and maybe Nathan Graves. All the Belmonts, Lecardes and Morris' are primarily weapon users. Grant and Maxim are both rogues/thieves. Sypha, Yoko and Charlotte are all primarily magic users. Stealing abilities from monsters is pretty much the pervue of Soma and Shanoa (unless I'm forgetting someone?). Amnesia is a common trope but when you add it with all the other stuff, I think the scales get tipped. Now I don't think anyone is saying Miriam is a total clone or using the comparison to Shanoa as an insult (I'd think it would be a compliment since I've always thought Shanoa was one of the most popular characters in the franchise). They are only saying there are a lot of similarities - obviously there are still different characters. Also yes, if Miriam was male, had a similar hair and outfit color to Soma and maybe some soul related power then comparisons would be made
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Post by Scars Unseen on Jan 10, 2016 20:38:02 GMT -6
Other than the appearance factors, of which there are more differences than similarities, most of that stuff can be counted as how Bloodstained is similar to Iga's Castlevania games more than anything specific to Shanoa. Almost every Castlevania character is a Magic Knight. Quite a lot of them involve fighting, if not friends, then former associates. Shanoa is hardly the first character to steal abilities from monsters. Pretty much all that leaves is amnesia, a *very* common trope in modern Japanese fiction. If Miriam was a male character, people would be claiming he was a Soma clone. Depending on how exactly the character will play, I'm sure that people might claim Zangetsu to be a "Soma clone". Considering his "Ofuda" magic and sword, I think he may be more likely thought of as an "Alucard clone". Certainly possible. I guess my point is that all of IGA's Castlevanias carry certain similarities, even his 3D titles, and I feel that Miriam is really only being compared to Shanoa as opposed to any other number of characters because she's a she.
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