gunlord500
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Hyped for Bloodstained 2!
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Post by gunlord500 on Jun 23, 2016 19:02:25 GMT -6
To be fair, ciel (and I'm not criticizing you or coming down on you or anything here, I'm just providing my perspective, which folks will hopefully find interesting ), there are reasons 'diversity' might be a good thing aside from filling quotas. In games, you want characters to be visually distinct, and you also want their appearances to reflect their playstyle. And that strikes me as a practical reason to pay at least a bit of homage to the 'path of the rainbow' XD What do I mean? Well, take a game that's all white males and sexy females. The characters will eventually get hard to tell apart unless they're given extremely divergent armor or have physical tells that differentiate them, and unless the character models are very detailed the tells will have to be extremely obvious to be useful (like, massive differences in body size, physical deformities, etc). But if you have a "diverse" cast with different skin colors and physiques, it's much easier for players to know who they're looking at when they play. For instance, in Overwatch, Symmetra, Lucian, Tracer, Widowmaker, Zarya, etc. can be differentiated at a glance, meaning that the cast is not just "diverse" in terms of nationality but also distinctive individually, making the game quicker to play and less confusing visually. Satisfying consumer demand for ethnic diversity *and* making the game easier to play? That sounds like a win in my book ;D So I think there are good reasons to take that approach besides just "ideology." Actually you just confirmed what I had said. Diversity for gameplay/story reason is fine, what isn't fine is forcing this on developers just because. They shouldn't feel obligated to create a diverse cast of characters if they don't want to. They shouldn't feel pressured to create something if they don't want to, this is my point. Well, I agree with that, and as folks above mentioned, nobody wants to force IGA to do anything he doesn't wanna do. Regardless of where we stand on diversity or politics or whatever, the Army of the Night is all united in our love for IGA and his games We're just givin him suggestions and things to think about, all in the hopes of making a better gameplay experience in even the smallest way
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Post by D. B. on Jun 23, 2016 19:23:12 GMT -6
I think the oversized boobs adds a lot to the creepiness of the boss.
Are you sure you have not conditioned yourself to kneejerk respond to large boobs in games?
You remind me of the Moms that used to complain about too much blood in games.
If you find this boss sexually attractive, you might have a monster fetish.
Better to accept yourself rather than force your self denial on everyone else.
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Post by LordKaiser on Jun 23, 2016 19:26:20 GMT -6
Since this thread was created again but with the boss instead of Miriam then I will simply say this:
Any developer or publisher who self censor their game because of external pressure that comes from people with a social agenda will not longer have my support and for me there won't be a middle ground. So I do hope that I will receive the kind of unrestricted game that I want to play and that threads like this don't affect development because the votes about a unrestricted game where more on that poll. This is the reason why I will not longer buy any Nintendo's products and why my game library is getting smaller.
For years we complained about video game censorship as soon as the internet became popular and we learned about it. During the 32/66 bit era we finally see developers taking more liberties and I remembered Symphony of the Night with naked monsters etc. and that game was a beautiful piece of art. This continued to the days of the PS2,Xbox and GC (even if some still got censored). But these days this nightmare is coming back and not from the religious sector this time but from people with a social agenda that have huge connections.
This is my stance in all this.
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gunlord500
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Hyped for Bloodstained 2!
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Post by gunlord500 on Jun 23, 2016 19:35:45 GMT -6
I think the oversized boobs adds a lot to the creepiness of the boss. Are you sure you have not conditioned yourself to kneejerk respond to large boobs in games? You remind me of the Moms that used to complain about too much blood in games. If you find this boss sexually attractive, you might have a monster fetish. Better to accept yourself rather than force your self denial on everyone else. I think the creepiness factor is a good point, yeah. I hadn't considered that before, you're right that it makes the boss seem scarier and more unsettling. That said, I'm gonna repeat what Mike said above, remember to be respectful. No overbearing moms or denialists or whatever here. Some folks might just want to critique what they perceive to be flaws in the boss design, or garish color schemes, or anything like that--they just wanna improve the game, not censor it. So even if we disagree, let's be respectful and calmly explain why we disagree rather than accusing folks of wanting to censor things, as that leads to more productive dialogue that will also help IGA and the devs more
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Post by parodiusdaryl on Jun 23, 2016 19:40:14 GMT -6
Hitting them deals increased damage, though, the face does the most damage. Land a fireball into it's mouth for increased damage as well!
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Post by stagedearthlanding on Jun 23, 2016 19:43:11 GMT -6
I'm sure it's not a popular opinion but the giant water boobs thing is kind of ridiculous. Not a big fan of the sexualized direction they seem to be taking with stuff in this one. I'm sure I'll be flamed to hell for that but I figured I'd give my opinion as one of the higher-tier backers Not going to completely disagree here, when I finally came across the boss for the first time, my first thoughts were "Really Iga? Really?". But I had the context of this beautiful look into the design process. So yes, the boss may be oversexualized, but only because when Iga designs a monster, he goes as far as he can in as many directions as he can. And if that means oversexualizing it, then it damn well better be the most oversexualized monster that can make it through whatever rating their aiming for. So I see it as less a cheap, juvenile appeal to certain audiences, and more the inevitable result of the beautiful lack of restraint which allows Iga to be the great designer that he is.
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zoned87
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Post by zoned87 on Jun 23, 2016 20:15:17 GMT -6
I wasn't offended by them just felt they needed a little more detail!
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thrashinuva
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Post by thrashinuva on Jun 23, 2016 20:34:38 GMT -6
I honestly don't know where to start on this topic.
Ultimately, I'm fine with the design. Anything that might feel "off" about the boss has nothing to do with the sexuality of it.
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Rixuel
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Post by Rixuel on Jun 23, 2016 20:40:33 GMT -6
Well yeah, it's too huge lol If the boss was a normal human size, I guess her cup size is around F lolll It's kinda embarrasing and funny at the same time maybe reduce it a little bit or put on more details so it's less noticeable? lol i can't stop laughing xD
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Post by hakureiillusion on Jun 23, 2016 20:45:06 GMT -6
Personally speaking, I have no strong opinion for or against it, but what I do believe is that the developers should be able to do whatever they want and achieve any vision they want with their own game. Especially for something as practically irrelevant as a (presumably unimportant to the story) boss's design. Just like I believe that people should certainly be able to find it distasteful or unappealing to them, but as long as it stops there and doesn't evolve into demanding that the devs change the game because of it or vilifying those who disagree.
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Post by thrashinuva on Jun 23, 2016 21:59:40 GMT -6
Well yeah, it's too huge lol If the boss was a normal human size, I guess her cup size is around F lolll It's kinda embarrasing and funny at the same time maybe reduce it a little bit or put on more details so it's less noticeable? lol i can't stop laughing xD But I mean, the boss isn't even human. What size would a cows udders be if they were human size?
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Post by Waifu4Life on Jun 23, 2016 22:52:37 GMT -6
IGA should pull a Blizzard, say that he'll change the boobs and then troll everyone by making them bigger
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Rixuel
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Post by Rixuel on Jun 23, 2016 23:17:17 GMT -6
Well yeah, it's too huge lol If the boss was a normal human size, I guess her cup size is around F lolll It's kinda embarrasing and funny at the same time maybe reduce it a little bit or put on more details so it's less noticeable? lol i can't stop laughing xD But I mean, the boss isn't even human. What size would a cows udders be if they were human size? I just compared the boss boobs with the boss head lol but yeah you have a point too, the boss is not human so maybe for a monster, it's normal lol
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Post by ShroudedTraveler on Jun 23, 2016 23:49:44 GMT -6
For what it's worth, I'll throw in with the people that found the boss creepy. It's been a while since a boss has created that squick feeling for me. Learning that Vespar is typically a male... Male + veiny water boobs + stomach mouth that spits + tentacles = squick action...
So, that would put me in camp don't-change-it.
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Post by Shanoa on Jun 24, 2016 0:29:15 GMT -6
But it's the boobs that offend people....? Troll topic or not i'm hardly surprised this would be a topic of discussion in this day and age. Personally? I'm fine with the design the same way i was fine with nipples-less Succubus in past Metroidvania titles. It's hardly bothersome.
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Post by lod7 on Jun 24, 2016 0:35:23 GMT -6
I am O.K with nudity, Just keep it tasteful.
Nudity done well that did not detract from the gameplay from past Igavanias were the succubus and lilith enemies from AoS and the DS titles as well as the succubus villain from SotN.
I particularly liked Bayonetta for being overly sexualized but since the game has such great sass the nudity enhances the game. And this game should strive for that same level of maturity. Catherine is also another game that depicts sensual acts/scenes that enhanced the overall package.
Nudity should be used to enhance the atmosphere and setting of the game and not feel like some tacked on design choice to make the game "edgy". If these monsters are depicted in myths and stories with sexualized parts jutting out make sure the tone of the character model conveys danger whether in confrontation, characterization, or environmental interaction. And the designers should have great foresight and a good understanding of their project to avoid tackiness.
Don't let me down Iga.
PS that sexy death moan made by the Succubus in SotN hahaha. Good memories.
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Post by dareka on Jun 24, 2016 0:47:28 GMT -6
I'd just like to say... "When the biggest controversy over the pre-alpha build of a crowd-funded game revolves around the boss character's boobs, you know the developers are on to something good."
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Post by Ashtear on Jun 24, 2016 0:53:26 GMT -6
I have a question for those saying the boss is sexualized. How is this in any way sexy? You can't slap big boobs on a grotesque monster and claim it is sexy. It has a hideous demon belly mouth. Tentacles too. This is a horrifying beast, Having an exaggerated female torso only makes it more disturbing, not sexy.
This boss is the stuff of nightmares, not wet dreams.
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Post by civilizedcactus on Jun 24, 2016 1:20:16 GMT -6
I have a question for those saying the boss is sexualized. How is this in any way sexy? You can't slap big boobs on a grotesque monster and claim it is sexy. It has a hideous demon belly mouth. Tentacles too. This is a horrifying beast, Having an exaggerated female torso only makes it more disturbing, not sexy. This boss is the stuff of nightmares, not wet dreams. A creature can have sexualized traits without itself being wholly sexy. If a monster has parts all over it that are/resemble genitalia, it is still grotesque, but it has sexual aspects to it. Not to arouse, but, as you said, make it more disturbing, and by extension, more interesting to look at. I wouldn't feel the need to defend the boss's design if people weren't bringing it up or feeling it needed to be changed. I personally really like its look and would be disappointed if it was changed. Aside from maybe the colors to make the crystals on its body pop a bit more.
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Post by demiurgos on Jun 24, 2016 2:07:58 GMT -6
I love the design of the boss. The physical attributes discussed make the boss look so much more monstrous and demonic. I'd love to have an animation of the presumably water filled tanks bursting during the fight, just to add to the brutifulness that already is a fact with this hellish being.
Kudos to whoever came up with the idea for this sea creature of the deep!
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