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Post by Wally on Jun 24, 2016 15:04:00 GMT -6
I am in love with the demo for far! Miriam's movements are perfect and I like her backdash the way it is. Now for some improvements I would personally like to see changed/added.
Miriam should be able to attack upwards similar to how the Belmonts could attack in eight different directions. At the very least, Miriam should be able to attack diagonally upward since she can attack diagonally downward.
I would love it if Miriam had a "movement shadow" effect similar to Alucard's in symphony of the night. It would add to Miriam's elegance.
The level up animation should either be shorter or not pause the game. It also wouldn't hurt to make an option where getting a shard doesn't pause the game either. This should especially happen in the speed run mode as any type of pauses will disrupt the pace of the game.
And lastly, I hope there will be street fighter themed inputs to cast spells.
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fatihG
Devil Forgemaster
Fifty Storms
I am the morning sun, come to vanquish this horrible night!
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Post by fatihG on Jun 24, 2016 16:16:40 GMT -6
After a bit more thought... Not a fan of the boss.
Now I don't care at all about her having giants boobs. It just feels like it is out of place. Too colorful, lacking detail compared to the things around her. Texture looks low rez. In previous castlevania games the bosses were always really detailed, like every pixel had a purpose. But than again with pixel art you kind of fill in the blanks yourself. Anyway it just look too smooth to me the way it is. The colours, it looks like they literally took the primary colours, red green and blue. Again, while I do not mind bosses or enemies being colourfull, I also do not think they should be this bright. The Dullahammer for example, it is pretty colourful as well. but I feel the saturation on it is done allot better. It has better contrast. Everything is pretty dark and dull, except for the bright orange spots. Those draw attention.
With the boss though, because everything is so colourful everything screems for attention
Also it almost feels like they designed her head/scarf, body and tentacles separately and then decided to combine all of 'em. The design could be more unified.
All in all, it is just a single boss and the first one from what I can tell. But if the first boss is an indication of what is to come, I really hope they put even more effort in the next bosses.
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Post by LordKaiser on Jun 24, 2016 16:27:55 GMT -6
Ok I played drought the demo and these are my findings:
Positive:
1- Using the environment to solve puzzles like cannons was good. 2- Breakable walls that either reveal a passage or a item was there. 3- The concept of magical shards was good and it's similar to the souls on Aria and Dawn of Sorrow and the Glyph in Order of Ecclesia. Returning features is not necessarily a bad thing after all. 4- The equipment suits Miriam well and I liked that some of them was visible on the character. 5- Some monsters at least have 2 or 3 death animations. 6- I like the menu interface and the icons are well drawn and detailed. It reminds me a bit of the old menu that Nihon Falcom used on some of their games like Ys I&II Complete for example and it's very appealing to me. 7- I like the Level Up font used. 8- The running on water sound was ok
Negative:
1- Miriam clip over things like walls, this may be the effect of using perspective projection. For the walls you may have to limit how close she can get to one and when she slides near a wall or a object like a box make her foot create a limit so her legs don't go thought objects. 2- Lack of Vsync and triple buffering options (Maybe these will hopefully be added to the final product.) 3- The splashing sound when you fall in water when jumping sounds weird.
Neutral:
1- Add more death animations to monsters based on the attack used. Morte's head chops the same way when it's killed with kicks and swords and gets destroyed the same regardless of the shard magic used. (See my thread about death animations) 2- Is there a reason why almost all monsters have the extra death animation of burning away?
So far I'm pleased with the results so I think that's it for now. If I find more stuff I will add them here.
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Post by Effigy on Jun 24, 2016 16:40:29 GMT -6
Played the demo through several times now and really like the look and feel of it. The game is definitely going in the right direction. My overall impression was extremely positive.
For the negatives, the end boss is the biggest one for me. She just looks out of place. Not so much her bright colours, which I understand is part of the stained glass motif, but her general lack of detail for her size, and the somewhat cartoony feeling of her overall design. She needs more detail and more menace - to really feel like a creature from the deeps. Make her tentacles these big slimy things with pulsating suckers, cover her in barnacles, have parts of wrecked ships hanging off her like crude jewelry, that sort of thing.
Aside from that the biggest minor concern for me was idle animations with the sword. Miriam's sword vanishes very quickly when you idle. I'd like it if she kept it out while equipped and played around with it a bit, maybe checked the blade for nicks, and tested it against her thumb or something. In fact, idle animations are great for getting a feel for the character, and a recent game that I think did them really well is Supergiant's "Transistor," where some of the idle animations were a real window into the feelings of the protagonist.
Anyway, really happy with the demo, as I said. Confident the finished game will meet my expectations.
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Post by zarbahd on Jun 24, 2016 17:45:49 GMT -6
- I love that the way you can replenish your magic/mana with the blue flowers but I thought instead of just blinking and disappearing like they do when you leave them for to long, they could look like their being blown away and separating into petals. - In Symphony of the Night while having no weapon or using a knuckle weapon, Alucard would do this beautifully executed spiral kick when jumping while holding diagonal down. I would love to see something similar to this in Bloodstained, since it was always one of my favorite animations and things to do in that game. I love that first idea! I just wanted to point out on the second thing though, you can do that in the demo as it is. You can, but the animation is very similar to the standard jump kick only tilting her foot at and angle. I was referring more to the animation itself from Symphony of the Night not necessarily the ability to perform it as I did find it myself while playing the demo.
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Post by comeonfhqwhgads on Jun 24, 2016 17:51:14 GMT -6
The demo is amazing so far. Top notch, the hype is real. Finer polish will come later, but they've nailed gamefeel right out of the gate.
Only thing that I can think of to say critically I have some issues with animation-cancelling being a little too sensitive, I feel. Like when you try to swing the Dullahammer shard in midair, if you touch ground before you complete the swing it just cancels out and disappears.
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Post by ARowe on Jun 24, 2016 17:58:38 GMT -6
From things people already commented on: I like the stats as they are, they don't need to be simplified for me. I like the sames of the different shard as they are, they don't need to be renamed unless the effective or familir shards are such a departure from expectations that they don't make any sense.
Pros: Directional shard using the right stick and right trigger is one of the most pleasing things I have done in a 2D game in a long time and made a very strong impression. Miriam's poses and the spell animations are wonderful. Thank you. Obtaining new shards animation is great, please keep it as it is. Miriam's Scarf is wonderful and I hope that it gets the dress up system treatment. I don't personally care if scarves give stats or if they are purely for visual aesthetics so long as you can vary them over the course of the game. I most want a version of the twilight cloak from SoTN for a translucent glow as an option. The dress up on the head piece and kung fu shoes were also nice touches. These is the kind of details that really makes me love a game and makes it more memorable for me so please keep at it. Monster death animations are good. That they change depending on how you kill them is great! Please feel free to push some of the death animations over the top. Those are still very vivid from SoTN and I gladly welcome that back.
Cons: After the first shard of a particular enemy is obtained, you continue to get procs for acquisition. This currently confuses me since it doesn't seem to level the abilities up or cause any notable event. So long as there is some kind of significance in the game, then it can stay exactly as it is. I don't like Miriam's right shoulder costuming. She has integrated plate on cloth and i feel like that shoulder would be a plate shoulder with the cloth sleeve coming out of it. The cloth shoulder is puffy and in the damp environment that the demo is in, would most likely be plastered, uncomfortably, to Miriam's shoulder. Considering her other shoulder is bare, I would assume she would want something more heavy duty for the added utility of being able to shoulder tackle something.
Suggestions: It's unclear what the second line in the equip screen for the weapon section is for. I assume there will be a shield or dual wield option at some point and that it will be utilized for that. If not, please delete it because that would drive me crazy, I would think I was missing something the entire game. I would like there to be some specialized moves for weapons like the down attack while in the air with fist weapons that allows you to jump off enemies heads or the down to forward attacks that many notable weapons like the Alucard Sword had in SoTN. Please have a well detailed bestiary that includes the amount of times you have slain an enemy. Please put a mandatory drop number on shards so that people will not run into the situation where they have been farming X for an entire day and they are as close to getting it as when they started. I don't personally care if that number is 1000+ if you deem that is the number, I just want to know that I'll be getting it eventually with certainty. The enemies could be more difficult. This is obviously a small sampling, so it's unfair to judge the entirety of the game on a small part. I would be delighted if there was a hard mode that made enemies AI more unpleasant to deal with or if they were just mean to begin with.
I've seen negative feedback from people on social media about the boss of the demo because it's a weird tentacle monster with pregnant-esque jiggle breasts and a mouth stomach. I just don't think some people realize how weird Japanese games that deal with demons can get and I think that kind of boss is part of the experience. This is definitely a part of the game I thought I was funding on kickstarter and so my expectations are being met. Please continue making this game as it is, it is exactly what I want to play. Thank you again.
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Risada
New Blood
[TI0]I've been dying for a snack. Come here...
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[TI0]I've been dying for a snack. Come here...
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Post by Risada on Jun 24, 2016 19:15:44 GMT -6
Overall, I agree with everything that has been said in the thread so far about the demo.
I like the shard system. I believe the additional shard drops are there because you can probably drop a higher quality shard to use (that star-grading information in each shard), allowing for most spells to keep being useful until late game.
Combat feels like a Igavania. I almost cried when Mirian started cutting stuff apart. Missing some upward slash / flash kick to hit stuff above Miriam's head, though...
I love how Buer and Vepar look like, particularly. Reminds you from the original myth, but with its own identity.
Now, a comment about Vepar:
All those people complaining about how he/she/it (IIRC the only female pillar was Gremory?)... Calm down.
There is much more ... weird depiction of myth around...
I have no problems with Vepar's appearance. Even the colors. They don't bother me.
Keep it up, Iga!
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Post by Seppuku on Jun 24, 2016 19:30:57 GMT -6
Finally found time to check out the demo. Everything I hoped it would be. Everyone has pretty well covered my pros/cons list, but I didn't see any mention of the attack animations. I love the animation and feel of the kick (especially the way she recoils her leg for a follow up attack) but while I was wailing on the boss at the end I thought it would be nice to see a couple of alternate animations. Set them up to attack in the same timing and strike the same hit box, but mix in a spinning back kick or (my personal favorite) a question mark kick just so it doesn't seem so bland/repetitive. The same could be done for other weapons (or not, it could be something exclusive to melee attacks) but I feel like it would really gives the player a sense of badassery when platforming while fighting to see variations in their attacks.
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Post by Cata on Jun 24, 2016 19:31:26 GMT -6
Just tried to play the demo but I for some reason the enemies weren't reacting as they I had hit them (the attack animation swings the sword right through them but they take no damage). This happens 90% of the time when I swing (I have restarted the demo several times to see if it was a one off) and I was wondering if anyone else encountered this.
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Post by markyjoe1990 on Jun 24, 2016 19:33:04 GMT -6
The demo looks and feels great. My only real concern is that the level design and enemy placement feels bland and repetitive. Admittedly, for me, that's kind a big deal. It didn't stop me from enjoying the demo, but there's a lot of empty hallways and "shelves" holding an enemy or two on it that you slash once and never think about again. It reminds me of Portrait Of Ruin, and I don't think that's a good thing.
I feel like the level design could do with positioning enemies in places that make them interesting/challenging to fight, kind of like how the classic Castlevanias did it. Off the top of my head, I think a lot about how skeletons were placed in Level 3 of Castlevania 1. The first one's places above you in a spot where it's hard for him to be effective (he has to constantly jump around between platforms, preventing him from attacking much), then as the stage goes on, he's placed in spots that further play into his strengths, such as below you, and in the case of Level 5, on a higher floor, allowing him to rain bones on you as you struggle to get up the stairs.
Like, changing the environment can greatly help with how effective, interesting, and varied the enemies can become, and this is without considering how you can combine two enemies in such a way that they synergize with each other as well, creating unique scenarios.
That's... really my only complaint. To my understanding, this ship area is supposed to be early in the game, so I shouldn't expect anything too crazy. But I think it would benefit wonderfully from more deliberate enemy positioning, and perhaps changing the layout here and there to accommodate that.
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Post by CastleDan on Jun 24, 2016 19:37:34 GMT -6
The demo looks and feels great. My only real concern is that the level design and enemy placement feels bland and repetitive. Admittedly, for me, that's kind a big deal. It didn't stop me from enjoying the demo, but there's a lot of empty hallways and "shelves" holding an enemy or two on it that you slash once and never think about again. It reminds me of Portrait Of Ruin, and I don't think that's a good thing. I feel like the level design could do with positioning enemies in places that make them interesting/challenging to fight, kind of like how the classic Castlevanias did it. Off the top of my head, I think a lot about how skeletons were placed in Level 3 of Castlevania 1. The first one's places above you in a spot where it's hard for him to be effective (he has to constantly jump around between platforms, preventing him from attacking much), then as the stage goes on, he's placed in spots that further play into his strengths, such as below you, and in the case of Level 5, on a higher floor, allowing him to rain bones on you as you struggle to get up the stairs. Like, changing the environment can greatly help with how effective, interesting, and varied the enemies can become, and this is without considering how you can combine two enemies in such a way that they synergize with each other as well, creating unique scenarios. That's... really my only complaint. To my understanding, this ship area is supposed to be early in the game, so I shouldn't expect anything too crazy. But I think it would benefit wonderfully from more deliberate enemy positioning, and perhaps changing the layout here and there to accommodate that. Enemy placement they said they're working on. Level design has been a huge concern for me for a long time. As it's one thing I feel like that's gotten worse as the games went on. So I hold out hope, i think the LEVEL looks good but I agree i feel like it's very flat and a bit repetitive. However, that could be because it's a dang boat.
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Sliditanko
New Blood
I'm a dedicated Mega Man - collector. That still doesn't mean I couldn't be a Bloodstained backer :)
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I'm a dedicated Mega Man - collector. That still doesn't mean I couldn't be a Bloodstained backer :)
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Post by Sliditanko on Jun 24, 2016 19:50:58 GMT -6
My only concern in the demo was that the first room(s) in the Galleon "Minerva" hurt my eyes badly as it was my first time playing. Maybe there was too many little details that I wasn't used to in the first sight. I think the backgrounds stabilized and were easier to explore after some time. I know this is just a little detail but I think throwing you in a scene full of little details at first sight isn't the best way to start. Maybe there should be some darker section first where you get used to the game's pace.. Like some inner room or something. My overall feeling is that this game will be pure AWESOME.
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Post by rytoex on Jun 24, 2016 20:20:20 GMT -6
<snip> Oh! I forgot, Is there a way to 100% the whole map? There are places so hard to reach, but I feel I'm missing something if I don't complete the map. earthfield As far as I can tell, no. There is/was supposedly a Super Jump glitch you could use to reach them, but I have been unable to execute it. Other than that, you could maybe use Cheat Engine or if you really wanted to see the 100% map. Either way, there are game crashing bugs if you get to doors or screen edges that are out of reach and go through them.
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Post by BlueBomberX on Jun 24, 2016 20:49:40 GMT -6
Overall, I liked it a lot. The character models look really nice, and Miriam controls really well. I like the music and the sounds are nice as well. The only suggestions that I have are:
1. I feel that her attacks should be a bit faster. They feel slow compared to your previous work.
2. her slide should go a little further.
3. Her turning doesn't seem quite as responsive as it should be. For example, pressing backward and then attack to slash behind you often results in you slashing in the wrong direction (forward) as her turn didn't register yet.
That's it. It's coming along really nicely, and I enjoyed my time with the demo. Keep up the excellent work!
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BahamutKaiser
New Blood
[TI0] Behold the horror, we must wait and pine u.u
Posts: 37
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[TI0] Behold the horror, we must wait and pine u.u
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Post by BahamutKaiser on Jun 24, 2016 21:00:01 GMT -6
I'm hoping they'll combine shards with chorded activation so you can access several different powers with one selection, and allow more powers to be at hand.
Like a set of fire powers from different shards compiled from different shards, Y for a splash, hold and release for a wave, duck and Y for something else.
More commands on hand.
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Rixuel
Loyal Familiar
[TI0] Adventurer/Gamer. Only believe what make sense.
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[TI0] Adventurer/Gamer. Only believe what make sense.
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Post by Rixuel on Jun 24, 2016 21:25:38 GMT -6
I play with Keyboard and I can't find the "analog movement".
If for keyboard users, there are no "analog movement", then I propose this as an "analog movement": Clicking the mousewheel and moving the mouse as an analog stick.
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Post by danceofpales on Jun 24, 2016 21:59:40 GMT -6
Great demo! The game appears to be on track to become legendary on the level of Symphony of the Night. I love the "level up" flair effect and the animation and monster design in general.
The only minor suggestions/feature requests I could make:
- Slight overtutorialization. Don't put up game-interrupting "press down-x to slide" type messages unless the player seems to be struggling to learn something. And likewise don't just come out and explain stuff like igniting the cannon fuse right away - it takes away the joy/accomplishment of discovery.
- Miriam's turning animation feels unresponsive, I think because she takes so long to turn her head around. I love how her feet touching down in her running animation match her actual velocity across the floor so it feels physically realistic and not like she's sliding along unrealistically. But her turn seems to make her slide a little or something. Make her turn feel sharper and quicker.
- I hope the monsters in the final game are tougher - especially the Dullahan and the boss looked scary at first but then they were disappointing pushovers. I want to feel afraid of the big monsters!
- Can all armor upgrades appear on the character eventually? You get like a leather armor or something during the demo level and it would be great if you could see it reflected on Miriam's in-game model (including her menu-screen model).
- The boss looks a little blurry or oversaturated or something I think because she is much larger than the other models but has a similar level of detail. Boss models might need more texture/geometry detail to get them to feel consistent with the smaller characters.
- One of the awesome things about previous Igavanias for me was the incredible diversity of monsters and encounters and atmospheres from room to room. Sometimes it felt like there was a new type of monster or multiple new types in every room. This demo doesn't quite get that variety and richness, but I assume it's because these are still the early days of Bloodstained and there hasn't been enough time to design and implement all the monsters and rooms. So I guess this suggestion is just: moar please!!!
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Post by kazoku=youkoso on Jun 24, 2016 22:53:43 GMT -6
Played to completion this time and more thoughts: When Miriam gets hit the animation should be improved so she gets hit and does a recovery back roll, right now it looks kinda janky. When Miriam dies it should have more of an effect instead of covering the screen; like she should shatter into glass. Collecting roses should leave petals effect, and some kind of sparkle when collecting coin. Dust/water effects on walking/landing, walking in water sound effect needs work sounds rough. Miriam's hair/skirt should move somewhat with physics. Miriam should maintain stance with weapon or the weapon should disappear with magical effect. Turning left and right in place does not look good and is slugglish feeling. Possibly have most weapons have a slow attack and a fast attack (a version that hits faster at lower damage or a single hit that does more damage) ; like with her kicks she should be able to mash the attack button and do a barrage of kicks like Chun Li especially after jumping or like Valmanway but less over powered as you'll be locked into place. Please put a forward dash by holding forward on the d-pad+dash button. Allow from backdash state to cancel into forward dash and allow it to be cancelled into anything besides another forward dash.
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Post by Ghostpepper on Jun 25, 2016 0:38:26 GMT -6
I would like the items to show when dropped instead of a generic sack for every item. But the good thing is if I'm nitpicking small things like this I loved everything else. Great job guys!
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