XombieMike
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Post by XombieMike on May 23, 2016 8:54:48 GMT -6
Now that a year has passed let's look at this video and see where time frame was mentioned after the Kickstarter was done.
The way it sounded to me was that resetting the time plan for the larger scope of work was very up front. Getting a beta ready for 2016 was an unofficial target back then.
I love how Ben talks about working with the community and Kickstarter transparency.
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Post by CastleDan on May 23, 2016 10:53:54 GMT -6
Now that a year has passed let's look at this video and see where time frame was mentioned after the Kickstarter was done. The way it sounded to me was that resetting the time plan for the larger scope of work was very up front. Getting a beta ready for 2016 was an unofficial target back then. I love how Ben talks about working with the community and Kickstarter transparency. It'll be interesting to see the update this month and find out whatever the E3 related info is. They mentioned in this they wanted it to be playable by E3, will it be? I wonder. Are they farther along then we think? Who knows... It'll be interesting to see the contents of this months update.
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XombieMike
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Post by XombieMike on May 23, 2016 11:46:21 GMT -6
I seriously doubt E3 will have a playable demo. That was probably just optimistic of Ben to want that for the backers. There was new talent brought in, an office move, and I think some other stuff that may have paced the project behind that original hope for a playable demo by E3.
I've never wanted to be so wrong though. I'd love to play a demo.
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Post by CastleDan on May 23, 2016 12:06:43 GMT -6
I seriously doubt E3 will have a playable demo. That was probably just optimistic of Ben to want that for the backers. There was new talent brought in, an office move, and I think some other stuff that may have paced the project behind that original hope for a playable demo by E3. I've never wanted to be so wrong though. I'd love to play a demo. New talent was brought in as well? That's cool. I mean who knows how far they actually are though? we've seen a detailed background, we've seen stage layouts, we've seen Miriam in action, we've seen a monster in action. I mean they might giving us tastes of things in lesser qualities so they can hold back till a bigger reveal. Who knows how far they ACTUALLY are....but you're right. I doubt a playable demo, but i'm typically overly optimistic lol. I mean what else COULD be at E3? A trailer? Wouldn't that suggest it's father along then we expect?
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Astaroth
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Post by Astaroth on May 23, 2016 13:14:29 GMT -6
yeah, curry the kid joined iga after the ks, and the office move affected igas part of the team for a little bit but they were still in contact with inti during that time, and most of the slowdown at the beginning was the discussions on locking down the shader (important for visuals like colors uvs bumpmaps textures and setting tone, but not for backend stuff like coding modeling assets or story), after that was out of the way theyve seemed to be progressing really quickly and they had the content planned out for mar-may ready at the end of feb so all this is leading up to something, and that e3 is mid june cant be a coincidence, whatever it is in june, its gonna be BIG! (runs past the shack and dives into the ditch)
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Post by CastleDan on May 23, 2016 13:21:01 GMT -6
yeah, curry the kid joined iga after the ks, and the office move affected igas part of the team for a little bit but they were still in contact with inti during that time, and most of the slowdown at the beginning was the discussions on locking down the shader (important for visuals like colors uvs bumpmaps textures and setting tone, but not for backend stuff like coding modeling assets or story), after that was out of the way theyve seemed to be progressing really quickly and they had the content planned out for mar-may ready at the end of feb so all this is leading up to something, and that e3 is mid june cant be a coincidence, whatever it is in june, its gonna be BIG! (runs past the shack and dives into the ditch) I totally forgot that and it's such a huge point to make that should be bolded. Ben saw all three of those major updates in FEB. So like I assumed in my previous post, they may have been holding things back for a big surprise at E3. Whether it be a playable demo, or just a trailer of some sort...who knows but that above point makes it more reasonable to believe.
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gunlord500
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Post by gunlord500 on May 23, 2016 17:26:08 GMT -6
yeah, curry the kid joined iga after the ks, and the office move affected igas part of the team for a little bit but they were still in contact with inti during that time, and most of the slowdown at the beginning was the discussions on locking down the shader (important for visuals like colors uvs bumpmaps textures and setting tone, but not for backend stuff like coding modeling assets or story), after that was out of the way theyve seemed to be progressing really quickly and they had the content planned out for mar-may ready at the end of feb so all this is leading up to something, and that e3 is mid june cant be a coincidence, whatever it is in june, its gonna be BIG! (runs past the shack and dives into the ditch) I totally forgot that and it's such a huge point to make that should be bolded. Ben saw all three of those major updates in FEB. So like I assumed in my previous post, they may have been holding things back for a big surprise at E3. Whether it be a playable demo, or just a trailer of some sort...who knows but that above point makes it more reasonable to believe. Daaamn, I'm getting excited!
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Post by Goobsausage on May 23, 2016 22:15:53 GMT -6
*Reads Astaroth and CastleDan 's posts* Allright Goob, try to avoid overhype and keep expectations reasonable, try to avoid overhype and keep expectations reasonable, try to avoid overhype and... * Brain blows a fuse and mouth makes the Jontron 'oooh' sound.* Kickstarter updates have been great so far, but if possible at E3 2016, I'd like to see a new interview with IGA and Ben from Gamespot that's a follow-up to this one where they discuss the timeline and say "This is what we had planned for Bloodstained by now, this is what we accomplished, here are there reasons why we've made the progress we have, and here are the new plans/set of goals for this time next year."
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Post by CastleDan on May 23, 2016 23:07:34 GMT -6
*Reads Astaroth and CastleDan 's posts* Allright Goob, try to avoid overhype and keep expectations reasonable, try to avoid overhype and keep expectations reasonable, try to avoid overhype and... * Brain blows a fuse and mouth makes the Jontron 'oooh' sound.* Kickstarter updates have been great so far, but if possible at E3 2016, I'd like to see a new interview with IGA and Ben from Gamespot that's a follow-up to this one where they discuss the timeline and say "This is what we had planned for Bloodstained by now, this is what we accomplished, here are there reasons why we've made the progress we have, and here are the new plans/set of goals for this time next year." That's exactly what I want as well. While the updates have been very awesome, I would love to know more about what they're specifically working on or how much they've achieved. Just to get a general idea on how things are progressing.
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Post by saberwolf94 on May 24, 2016 21:44:07 GMT -6
Man I already watched this video like twenty times. For me, am more looking for a general update rather than a demo with all the staggered release talks going around am more concerned about that to be honest. I'd be good to see how IGA and team feel about this and what will be their plans. Am not gonna lie am not keen on the idea at all.
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Post by CastleDan on May 25, 2016 10:01:04 GMT -6
Man I already watched this video like twenty times. For me, am more looking for a general update rather than a demo with all the staggered release talks going around am more concerned about that to be honest. I'd be good to see how IGA and team feel about this and what will be their plans. Am not gonna lie am not keen on the idea at all. I'm not concerned. I get to play the game I care about sooner and then get a stream of updates to keep my attention as they get completed. I'm in this for the main game and the stuff that typically comes with igavania's like 2nd playable character or boss rush.... The other stuff to me is glorified free DLC content and glorified DLC content shouldn't keep this main game away from us an extra year or so...
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Post by saberwolf94 on May 26, 2016 1:41:04 GMT -6
Man I already watched this video like twenty times. For me, am more looking for a general update rather than a demo with all the staggered release talks going around am more concerned about that to be honest. I'd be good to see how IGA and team feel about this and what will be their plans. Am not gonna lie am not keen on the idea at all. I'm not concerned. I get to play the game I care about sooner and then get a stream of updates to keep my attention as they get completed. I'm in this for the main game and the stuff that typically comes with igavania's like 2nd playable character or boss rush.... The other stuff to me is glorified free DLC content and glorified DLC content shouldn't keep this main game away from us an extra year or so... Am aware am probably in the minority regarding this opinion, but honestly this is a more complicated topic that people give it credit for. It isn't as simple as your description of just playing the main game and then the other stuff comes later.
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Post by CastleDan on May 26, 2016 9:51:43 GMT -6
I'm not concerned. I get to play the game I care about sooner and then get a stream of updates to keep my attention as they get completed. I'm in this for the main game and the stuff that typically comes with igavania's like 2nd playable character or boss rush.... The other stuff to me is glorified free DLC content and glorified DLC content shouldn't keep this main game away from us an extra year or so... Am aware am probably in the minority regarding this opinion, but honestly this is a more complicated topic that people give it credit for. It isn't as simple as your description of just playing the main game and then the other stuff comes later. Well please explain, I'm having a hard time seeing the difficulty of this. You bought everything and everything will come but instead of waiting an absurd amount of time for modes that were never originally intended to even be in the game you get what was intended and then you can download the rest as it becomes finished. I get people who like to collect things wants a full package which is why I can SORTA understand why holding back the physical copy might be okay, even though I think that's unneeded. We live in an age where games get DLC and a lot of the content the game got added on sounds like the kind of content you'd get AS DLC.
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XombieMike
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Post by XombieMike on May 26, 2016 10:31:50 GMT -6
Am aware am probably in the minority regarding this opinion, but honestly this is a more complicated topic that people give it credit for. It isn't as simple as your description of just playing the main game and then the other stuff comes later. Well please explain, I'm having a hard time seeing the difficulty of this. You bought everything and everything will come but instead of waiting an absurd amount of time for modes that were never originally intended to even be in the game you get what was intended and then you can download the rest as it becomes finished. I get people who like to collect things wants a full package which is why I can SORTA understand why holding back the physical copy might be okay, even though I think that's unneeded. We live in an age where games get DLC and a lot of the content the game got added on sounds like the kind of content you'd get AS DLC. We don't know yet what content will be treated as additional, and some of the stretch goals are important for backers to have on day 1 on their physical copy. It is easier to say it's more complicated than it is to list out every reason for every feature based on one individuals feelings and personal reasons. Backers were not expecting a DLC type roll out of the game when they backed the project. This isn't a simple and clean cut discussion or decision, and that's why people are writing articles and talking about it. I agree that we can't simply explain this topic away with logic and make everyone happy. People are going to feel how they feel about this stuff. Feelings are neutral, neither right or wrong, and logic will not always apply. Until we know what content will not be available upon initial physical release, let's be patient and open minded toward the concerns of those who made this project possible.
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Post by CastleDan on May 26, 2016 15:34:55 GMT -6
Well please explain, I'm having a hard time seeing the difficulty of this. You bought everything and everything will come but instead of waiting an absurd amount of time for modes that were never originally intended to even be in the game you get what was intended and then you can download the rest as it becomes finished. I get people who like to collect things wants a full package which is why I can SORTA understand why holding back the physical copy might be okay, even though I think that's unneeded. We live in an age where games get DLC and a lot of the content the game got added on sounds like the kind of content you'd get AS DLC. We don't know yet what content will be treated as additional, and some of the stretch goals are important for backers to have on day 1 on their physical copy. It is easier to say it's more complicated than it is to list out every reason for every feature based on one individuals feelings and personal reasons. Backers were not expecting a DLC type roll out of the game when they backed the project. This isn't a simple and clean cut discussion or decision, and that's why people are writing articles and talking about it. I agree that we can't simply explain this topic away with logic and make everyone happy. People are going to feel how they feel about this stuff. Feelings are neutral, neither right or wrong, and logic will not always apply. Until we know what content will not be available upon initial physical release, let's be patient and open minded toward the concerns of those who made this project possible. Right but this is the decision that the team made and I respect their views on it above anyone else's including my own ( even though I side with them ) . They're the ones making the game and they're the ones that deem this the best approach probably because it'd take far too long if they waited for everything to be done and puts them in quite a rush to get things completed which sacrifices quality. People listing demands like ...you should hold off certain physical copies for the people who want all the content is kinda extreme for a team that has enough to worry about. I'm not saying people don't have a right to be annoyed but I think they're doing it for the right reasons. You can't please everyone and I'm willing to bet you're more willing to piss off more people by holding the main game much longer due to extra modes, then the other way around. Which was exemplified by the Mighty No 9 fiasco all over the web.
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Post by crocodile on May 26, 2016 15:49:32 GMT -6
Well please explain, I'm having a hard time seeing the difficulty of this. You bought everything and everything will come but instead of waiting an absurd amount of time for modes that were never originally intended to even be in the game you get what was intended and then you can download the rest as it becomes finished. I get people who like to collect things wants a full package which is why I can SORTA understand why holding back the physical copy might be okay, even though I think that's unneeded. We live in an age where games get DLC and a lot of the content the game got added on sounds like the kind of content you'd get AS DLC. We don't know yet what content will be treated as additional, and some of the stretch goals are important for backers to have on day 1 on their physical copy. It is easier to say it's more complicated than it is to list out every reason for every feature based on one individuals feelings and personal reasons. Backers were not expecting a DLC type roll out of the game when they backed the project. This isn't a simple and clean cut discussion or decision, and that's why people are writing articles and talking about it. I agree that we can't simply explain this topic away with logic and make everyone happy. People are going to feel how they feel about this stuff. Feelings are neutral, neither right or wrong, and logic will not always apply. Until we know what content will not be available upon initial physical release, let's be patient and open minded toward the concerns of those who made this project possible. I'm just going to interject to add A) Given the release patterns of other games, including other kickstarter projects, I was not ready to assume that the entire game would be release at once or would all be on the disc. In fact the release pattern was a question I always had in the back of my mind but I knew they would answer on their own terms. Given that we know they spent a lot of time during the actual campaign brainstorming extra stretch goals, I don't think it was fair to assume they knew what exactly they would launch with given what they pulled in. I bet they still don't know everything they will launch with yet but they have a better idea now certainly and realize they can't deliver all the promised content in a reasonable time frame B) I think everybody should always be treated with respect but I don't think their opinions have to be respected if they are devoid of logic. That isn't a license to be mean to people at all but if people are saying things that don't make sense or are entirely emotionally driven, I think its fair to call them out on it. I can appreciate the concerns or frustrations of others but that doesn't necessarily mean they are reasonable or the demands made in the name of those frustrations and concerns are reasonable. At the end of the day its up to the dev team to decide that though. I'm just offering my opinion.
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gunlord500
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Post by gunlord500 on May 26, 2016 15:51:43 GMT -6
We don't know yet what content will be treated as additional, and some of the stretch goals are important for backers to have on day 1 on their physical copy. It is easier to say it's more complicated than it is to list out every reason for every feature based on one individuals feelings and personal reasons. Backers were not expecting a DLC type roll out of the game when they backed the project. This isn't a simple and clean cut discussion or decision, and that's why people are writing articles and talking about it. I agree that we can't simply explain this topic away with logic and make everyone happy. People are going to feel how they feel about this stuff. Feelings are neutral, neither right or wrong, and logic will not always apply. Until we know what content will not be available upon initial physical release, let's be patient and open minded toward the concerns of those who made this project possible. Right but this is the decision that the team made and I respect their views on it above anyone else's including my own ( even though I side with them ) . They're the ones making the game and they're the ones that deem this the best approach probably because it'd take far too long if they waited for everything to be done and puts them in quite a rush to get things completed which sacrifices quality. People listing demands like ...you should hold off certain physical copies for the people who want all the content is kinda extreme for a team that has enough to worry about. I'm not saying people don't have a right to be annoyed but I think they're doing it for the right reasons. You can't please everyone and I'm willing to bet you're more willing to piss off more people by holding the main game much longer due to extra modes, then the other way around. Which was exemplified by the Mighty No 9 fiasco all over the web. Yeah, I think you raise a good point, Castledan. In today's environment, especially given the controversy around MN9, delays can seem even more irritating than staggered content to a lot of people. While it might be nice to have everything out in one shot, if you can't do that, staggered content definitely seems like the lesser of two evils. Especially since feedback on the base game can guide development on the extra stuff, offering you a chance to avoid problems that might have been encountered without advance warning if you'd just released the whole package straight up.
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Post by CastleDan on May 26, 2016 17:53:30 GMT -6
We don't know yet what content will be treated as additional, and some of the stretch goals are important for backers to have on day 1 on their physical copy. It is easier to say it's more complicated than it is to list out every reason for every feature based on one individuals feelings and personal reasons. Backers were not expecting a DLC type roll out of the game when they backed the project. This isn't a simple and clean cut discussion or decision, and that's why people are writing articles and talking about it. I agree that we can't simply explain this topic away with logic and make everyone happy. People are going to feel how they feel about this stuff. Feelings are neutral, neither right or wrong, and logic will not always apply. Until we know what content will not be available upon initial physical release, let's be patient and open minded toward the concerns of those who made this project possible. I'm just going to interject to add A) Given the release patterns of other games, including other kickstarter projects, I was not ready to assume that the entire game would be release at once or would all be on the disc. In fact the release pattern was a question I always had in the back of my mind but I knew they would answer on their own terms. Given that we know they spent a lot of time during the actual campaign brainstorming extra stretch goals, I don't think it was fair to assume they knew what exactly they would launch with given what they pulled in. I bet they still don't know everything they will launch with yet but they have a better idea now certainly and realize they can't deliver all the promised content in a reasonable time frame B) I think everybody should always be treated with respect but I don't think their opinions have to be respected if they are devoid of logic. That isn't a license to be mean to people at all but if people are saying things that don't make sense or are entirely emotionally driven, I think its fair to call them out on it. I can appreciate the concerns or frustrations of others but that doesn't necessarily mean they are reasonable or the demands made in the name of those frustrations and concerns are reasonable. At the end of the day its up to the dev team to decide that though. I'm just offering my opinion. I've been agreeing with you too much lately. We need to manufacture something to argue about!
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Post by saberwolf94 on May 27, 2016 0:05:26 GMT -6
Ok I was going to leave this be but it turned to a hot topic and since am responsible I'll share a few more words.
To crocodile, it is entirely up to you to respect or not want to respect an opinion that doesn't follow a rational explanation that meet your thoughts, am a person like that too, however in my life at least there are some things where you can't bring yourself to accept and/or apply logic (not talking about Bloodstained and games for that matter). We're not robots and one of my beliefs is that logic stops where emotion begins. I had to ask for a favor that the majority of people would consider paranoid, something I knew isn't the norm but was completely possible and achievable as long as the person agreed.
Second, just because am possibly the minority doesn't mean that my opinion is illogical because it isn't. If the situation was reserved and mostly everybody preferred waiting more does that mean that the few people that were fine with a staggered release are crazy? No, it's just a matter if what works for you and in this case what's best for the majority. I realize that and of course I'll live with it and besides we don't even have concrete information of how will this work if it even happens. Which is why I was going to wait. I may even change my opinion depending on what I hear. I never demanded for things to run the way I saw fit.
Third, of course I knew from the beginning that since the game expanded so much by the end of the kickstarter that it was completely possible that they may not reach the deadline. If we had to wait 4 or 5 more months, hey it would have stung but I'd live with it. This depends on so many factors though. If they approach us and tell us the situation and the options, what they have calculated and how it will work for them as well people can decide what's best and some sort of poll or vote can decide. If it's like some of you say that the full game will be released and only something like external modes such as boss rush will be excluded then yeah it could become a different story. But the certain thing is that it makes things more complicated. You can't tell me it wouldn't be easier for them to just worry about a single release.
There are different factors and variables in this that can affect something which will affect something else. It's like some sort of mathematic equation. I can't really put to words what the scenarios are since am not there developing the game nor I know what the developers think is best for the game. For the people that can't wait to play the game and support this ideology more power to you, in the end chances are the game will turn out fine anyway. But am favoring them taking their time for everything, worrying about releasing a single package the way the initially intended.
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Post by demiurgos on May 27, 2016 4:25:36 GMT -6
What are the postulates when it comes to the desirable outcome for the physical release of this game? If we all can agree upon these implicit premisses we can start talking about what is logical and what is not. Ok.
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