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Post by Aztec on Aug 20, 2018 18:00:40 GMT -6
What some people dont understand is that backing a Kickstarter project is a donation, not a pre-order. Of course when they promise something they should deliver but they're not on a contract with you. If things change they can and will change them and there's little to nothing you can do about it short of asking for a refund.
There are risks and chaallenges when backing these projects and I'd be amazed if most of the Vita backers dont have at least one other viable current platform for gaming in 2019. Anyone who's hardcore enough to own a Vita is also hardcore enough to own at least one other platform, I remember reading somewhere that the vast majority of Vita users owned also a PS4 at least. I cant imagine there will be a significant amount of backers asking for a refund since most will probbaly just change the platform.
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Post by magren on Aug 20, 2018 18:12:06 GMT -6
Very interesting. Well, here's hoping I'll get that fangamer e-mail soon so I can get a refund, then. I like how quickly they changed the Pledge info back on the Kickstarter page! I only went with the $60 version to get the Vita physical release, not the super-high priced one, however, so I guess I'll have to see how this goes. I'm disappointed, but not really surprised other than the lack of a digital version (which I wouldn't want anyway, considering I want this thing on the Vita, and memory card space is a premium on this thing).
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Post by spideryfingers on Aug 20, 2018 18:42:37 GMT -6
It's kinda on a par with setting up a date with the hottest babe in town and then receiving the deflating news that she was just leading you on and never interested from the outset. Massive kick in the balls this one!
In this day and age, one would expect gaming to branch out to cover the entire spectrum but, sadly, it isn't. Not really taking a big step forward ... more like taking a sly step sideways!
Sony are beginning to slip down to Konami's level.
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Post by Waifu4Life on Aug 20, 2018 19:19:21 GMT -6
What some people dont understand is that backing a Kickstarter project is a donation, not a pre-order. Of course when they promise something they should deliver but they're not on a contract with you. If things change they can and will change them and there's little to nothing you can do about it short of asking for a refund. There are risks and chaallenges when backing these projects and I'd be amazed if most of the Vita backers dont have at least one other viable current platform for gaming in 2019. Anyone who's hardcore enough to own a Vita is also hardcore enough to own at least one other platform, I remember reading somewhere that the vast majority of Vita users owned also a PS4 at least. I cant imagine there will be a significant amount of backers asking for a refund since most will probbaly just change the platform. Oh we get it mate, but what you don't get that it's suicidal for a veteran game designer to start such a project and not deliver on his/her promises. Comcept, that's gone man, merged with Level 5 so that Inafune could save his own ass. Until I see working videos of a working Vita and Wii U prototype, I'm sticking with my belief that no such ports were in the works, that these were just stretch goals to bate Vita and Nintendo users. PC, PS4 and XBONE were always the main platforms, once the were complete, then they were to let Armature Studio port them to the platforms they were made in charge of. What did they think would happen if they waited 3 years to port something for unpopular platforms? It's already a miracle that the Vita is still getting new physical games from big Japanese game developers in 2018. At best, they should have waited to see if SONY would announce a Switch competitor at TGB2018 next month 😒 BREAKING NEWS:While I was typing this, I got a reply from Fangamer. As I stated before, I purchased the $300 Collector's Box as well as an extra Vita copy. They've offered me 2 choices: 1- Keep the collector's box with another version of the game and refund my extra copy 2- Refund $150 and downgrade to the $175 tier. This means that I'm also keep the extra physical copy for $35 I've politely asked them the reasoning behind these choices before deciding, I'll keep you guys updated.
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ZeroSbr
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Post by ZeroSbr on Aug 20, 2018 20:18:18 GMT -6
What some people dont understand is that backing a Kickstarter project is a donation, not a pre-order. Of course when they promise something they should deliver but they're not on a contract with you. If things change they can and will change them and there's little to nothing you can do about it short of asking for a refund. There are risks and chaallenges when backing these projects and I'd be amazed if most of the Vita backers dont have at least one other viable current platform for gaming in 2019. Anyone who's hardcore enough to own a Vita is also hardcore enough to own at least one other platform, I remember reading somewhere that the vast majority of Vita users owned also a PS4 at least. I cant imagine there will be a significant amount of backers asking for a refund since most will probbaly just change the platform. Like the other guy said, we understand how Kickstarters work quite well. We understand that it's a donation, but it's a donation based on trust. Trust that the promises made will be fulfilled. Trust that IGA would deliver what he said he would deliver when he said he would deliver it. We are upset because these promises were broken, and our trust has been betrayed. We were let down. I donated believing that IGA would not let everyone down like Inafune. I figured that IGA had actual experience working on these types of games and could get his vision completed within the time allotted, especially with his track record of developing good games fairly quickly. Obviously, I was wrong, and this is just another high profile Kickstarter disaster that makes the entire platform (and perhaps even the concept of crowdfunding) seem like a joke and a waste of money. When you have several high profile crowdfunded titles like MN9, Unsung Story, Yooka Laylee, and now this that end up as disasters for various reasons, you lose a lot of faith.
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Post by azmodan79 on Aug 21, 2018 3:48:54 GMT -6
No vita version, no game for me...This sucks royally. Going for a refund but seems that the 60 bucks tier is not eligible. Why put a tier and advertise it for so long if you had no intention of fulfilling the promise? This is effed up.
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Post by saberwolf94 on Aug 21, 2018 4:57:38 GMT -6
I just had to make a video, tried to be as objective as possible but fair to say I did back a digital ps vita copy.
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Post by Waifu4Life on Aug 21, 2018 7:30:28 GMT -6
I've been reading a lot about people saying that the Vita wouldn't have been able to run this game. I get the feeling that these people haven't played a lot of games on the Vita to begin with. I have a large library of physical Vita games I can can say this, this systems works great with 2D and 2.5D. If I compare these games on a PS3 at 720p and PSTV at 720p: Rayman Origins, Rayman Legend (with a homebrew that allows gyromotions on PSTV) and Dragon's Crown, I can barely tell them apart. And yes I know, Bloodstained was never planned for the PS3, but can you serious say that this system wouldn't be able to handle that game?
I doubt a major downgrade would have been required to run this game on the Vita, but I guess we'll never know now.
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Post by demiurgos on Aug 21, 2018 7:34:30 GMT -6
I'm STILL beyond words to describe how disappointed I am.
Please, anyone! Describe the obstacles for NOT making the vita version come true. Region 3 will continue the vita support beyond 2020. Game cards are avaliable. What is the true reason behind this cancelation, that was still on track just a few months ago (May)... conveniently (?) before the slacker backer period ended. Armature has been working on this for quite some time, right? What about their work on the engine adaptation for vita? WTF, etc.?
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Post by Waifu4Life on Aug 21, 2018 7:43:13 GMT -6
.....Armature has been working on this for quite some time, right? What about their work on the engine adaptation for vita? WTF, etc.? Have you seen any screenshot of gameplay video of the Vita or Wii U? No? Well that's because they haven't done anything up to this point. The main platforms were always PS4, XBONE and PC, the "plan" was to have Armature port them to the Vita and Wii U. When the Wii U version was scrapped in favor of the Switch, I jumped on the forums to ask about the Vita version, people said that everything was still on track for that port. but it was then I realised that we had yet to see any proof that it was in development. I asked a few more time as the months passed about news, screenshot and videos, but no, nothing. A few months later and now here we are 😠
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purifyweirdshard
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Aug 21, 2018 9:25:13 GMT -6
No vita version, no game for me...This sucks royally. Going for a refund but seems that the 60 bucks tier is not eligible. Why put a tier and advertise it for so long if you had no intention of fulfilling the promise? This is effed up. Wait, that should definitely be eligible. The only ones that aren't would be "limited" tiers that involved game design or the production of very limited items, etc. On the other side of the discussion, I think the Vita could have handled Bloodstained, yes, but only after the significant re-tooling to have Unreal 4 run on the system, an effort that originally would have seen Armature develop such for the Vita and Wii U, and then release the code publicly in both cases for others to use. At the time, that sounded like a really nice and cool thing to do. Now, it would mean almost nothing, and doing such for only the Vita, in a situation where we were already looking at Bloodstained being very possibly the last physical Vita game to exist. It was looking like a whole lot of effort to put into something that may not be able to actually launch at all, and even if it did likely not recoup any costs. It'd be a collector's dream, but a very shaky publishing effort. The main/only sense it would make would be to fulfill the slated promise to backers, but even that has been made difficult by not only the development circumstances for the platform, but Sony themselves. Many of the folks that selected it I imagine did so under the expectation that "man this will be really rare". They might play it, they might not. For any online features or later DLC, they'd probably have to use something else even if they wanted.
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Post by Overlord on Aug 21, 2018 9:34:06 GMT -6
I'd imagine they can't do it digitally because of Sony. There are, possibly, servers specifically for the Vita. Some that hold the games and some that allow for online play to be possible. Perhaps others that perform other tasks aside from login authentication and security. So it would be Sony's call to stop spending money on these servers and this would be why digital release isn't a possibility. I know the topic creator already mentioned this, but I want to reaffirm that this makes no sense, especially considering you can still download/buy PSP games on the PSN.
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Post by Squirrel Taskmaster on Aug 21, 2018 10:15:36 GMT -6
Really, this was inevitable. I'm not saying it's cool or anything for the people that wanted it on Vita, just that the Vita's writing has been on the wall for a solid year and a half at least. I'll be surprised if any unreleased crowdfund game going forward that had Vita in its list actually turns up on the system.
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Post by Waifu4Life on Aug 21, 2018 11:06:27 GMT -6
Really, this was inevitable. I'm not saying it's cool or anything for the people that wanted it on Vita, just that the Vita's writing has been on the wall for a solid year and a half at least. I'll be surprised if any unreleased crowdfund game going forward that had Vita in its list actually turns up on the system. You're not looking at the Vita on a Global point of view. While it's not the most popular thing in the world, in Japan and other Asian countries, they still publish games, they still buy games and hardware. In terms of sales, if the 3DS didn't manage the hold a candle next to the NDS, no way the Vita was gonna do better than the PSP, the market changes over the years.
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Post by Jango on Aug 21, 2018 12:26:38 GMT -6
I understand that a lot of people are salty after the announcements so emotional posts are expected. That said, if anyone thinks that the Bloodstained devs cancelled the Vita port for any reason besides them absolutely having to then you're a fool. There is 100% no way they would make such a decision and willingly welcome the backlash and PR bomb that goes with it. No. Their backs were clearly up against the wall here. Again, I know people are upset and disappointed but it's important to maintain a three-dimensional perspective here.
And in the spirit of maintaining that three-dimensional perspective, for all the people complaining about Kickstarter game development always disappointing in some capacity remember that Iga actually said he agrees with you. haha In traditional game development the public almost never learned a title existed until it was about 70% completed. Obviously that strategy circumvents almost all the problems most frequently plaguing Kickstarter games. The speedbumps Bloodstained has ran into are no different than the ones large publisher games face. Unfortunately, most consumers don't care to do their homework or understand the nature of the production they're investing in with Kickstarter. Getting a peek behind the curtain of game development comes with a price. Believe it or not it's not all fun and games.
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Post by Waifu4Life on Aug 21, 2018 12:45:51 GMT -6
I understand that a lot of people are salty after the announcements so emotional posts are expected. That said, if anyone thinks that the Bloodstained devs cancelled the Vita port for any reason besides them absolutely having to then you're a fool. There is 100% no way they would make such a decision and willingly welcome the backlash and PR bomb that goes with it. No. Their backs were clearly up against the wall here. Again, I know people are upset and disappointed but it's important to maintain a three-dimensional perspective here. The burden of proof is on them. They need to show us that it wasn't possible via a DEMO, video or at lease better technical explanations. Right now, there are too many contradictions on their reasoning behind the cancelation (which I said a few times in this topic). On a personal note, using the term "salty" in normally associated with trolling and mocking people. Would I be correct to assume that you didn't back this game for a Vita version?
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Post by demiurgos on Aug 21, 2018 12:48:36 GMT -6
No vita version, no game for me...This sucks royally. Going for a refund but seems that the 60 bucks tier is not eligible. Why put a tier and advertise it for so long if you had no intention of fulfilling the promise? This is effed up. Wait, that should definitely be eligible. The only ones that aren't would be "limited" tiers that involved game design or the production of very limited items, etc. On the other side of the discussion, I think the Vita could have handled Bloodstained, yes, but only after the significant re-tooling to have Unreal 4 run on the system, an effort that originally would have seen Armature develop such for the Vita and Wii U, and then release the code publicly in both cases for others to use. At the time, that sounded like a really nice and cool thing to do. Now, it would mean almost nothing, and doing such for only the Vita, in a situation where we were already looking at Bloodstained being very possibly the last physical Vita game to exist.It was looking like a whole lot of effort to put into something that may not be able to actually launch at all, and even if it did likely not recoup any costs. It'd be a collector's dream, but a very shaky publishing effort. The main/only sense it would make would be to fulfill the slated promise to backers, but even that has been made difficult by not only the development circumstances for the platform, but Sony themselves. Many of the folks that selected it I imagine did so under the expectation that "man this will be really rare". They might play it, they might not. For any online features or later DLC, they'd probably have to use something else even if they wanted. Seriously? What about LRG who will be putting out vita games through 2019 and possibly 2020? What about SLG who just made a VERY successful vita announcement? What about R3 EAS? In the light of this, what tells you that Bloodstained probably will be the last vita game?
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Post by Fuck this on Aug 21, 2018 12:56:53 GMT -6
I only cared for the Vita version. I'm getting a full refund and never supporting any of these assholes again.
Two months ago I was told the Vita version is running fine and suddenly it's cancelled? No thanks. You guys don't deserve my money.
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purifyweirdshard
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Post by purifyweirdshard on Aug 21, 2018 14:59:46 GMT -6
Wait, that should definitely be eligible. The only ones that aren't would be "limited" tiers that involved game design or the production of very limited items, etc. On the other side of the discussion, I think the Vita could have handled Bloodstained, yes, but only after the significant re-tooling to have Unreal 4 run on the system, an effort that originally would have seen Armature develop such for the Vita and Wii U, and then release the code publicly in both cases for others to use. At the time, that sounded like a really nice and cool thing to do. Now, it would mean almost nothing, and doing such for only the Vita, in a situation where we were already looking at Bloodstained being very possibly the last physical Vita game to exist.It was looking like a whole lot of effort to put into something that may not be able to actually launch at all, and even if it did likely not recoup any costs. It'd be a collector's dream, but a very shaky publishing effort. The main/only sense it would make would be to fulfill the slated promise to backers, but even that has been made difficult by not only the development circumstances for the platform, but Sony themselves. Many of the folks that selected it I imagine did so under the expectation that "man this will be really rare". They might play it, they might not. For any online features or later DLC, they'd probably have to use something else even if they wanted. Seriously? What about LRG who will be putting out vita games through 2019 and possibly 2020? What about SLG who just made a VERY successful vita announcement? What about R3 EAS? In the light of this, what tells you that Bloodstained probably will be the last vita game? I don't consider what LRG/SLG and other similar companies do as official new game releases, from what I understand all they do is port existing games under license from the developer that already exist as downloadable on that same platform. It's not all that different from how much, MUCH later on, people do things like this: i.ytimg.com/vi/1UFc-41le20/maxresdefault.jpgWhich I also don't really consider actual additions to the NES/SNES library, cool as it might be that people do these things. not long ago there was a "new" SNES fighting game released on a cart, same as with that. I see most of these things as glorified repros with one of the main selling points and draws being how extremely limited they are, which also keeps things less risky/profitable for the...micro publisher I guess we'll call them. It's also weird how almsot all of the pics I've seen of their actual cases don't have ESRB ratings on them. I know these guys are official enough to exist, at least, and didn't think you could do that.
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Post by demiurgos on Aug 21, 2018 15:26:37 GMT -6
We were discussing "the last physical Vita game to exist" (your words) in regards to the possibility to publish physical vita games in 2019 or later. What you consider "official new game releases" is irrelevant to this.
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