Pure Miriam
Legendary Comrade
Shardbinder
[TI1] "A new, vital heart, pulsing with the old blood." -IGA
Posts: 1,068
inherit
Legendary Comrade
445
0
Oct 20, 2019 3:32:00 GMT -6
1,600
Pure Miriam
[TI1] "A new, vital heart, pulsing with the old blood." -IGA
1,068
Jul 25, 2015 2:19:20 GMT -6
July 2015
puremiriam
|
Post by Pure Miriam on Apr 26, 2018 1:44:31 GMT -6
Bestiary. Among many things that Symphony of the Night did to the Castlevania games, was the creation of a bestiary. A list of all the game's monsters, with their data and information. From Symphony ownards, some changes and modifications happened, addition of information and the introduction of certain things. Just as a remind, here's a quick summary of how bestiary worked in the past, among all Igavania games: Castlevania: Symphony of the Night: The first bestiary on Igavania games. Can only be acessed at the game's shop. Shows enemy picture, level, Health, drop information, EXP given, among other basic information. Something interesting is that the EXP given is almost useless, thanks to Symphony of the Night's EXP degradation system (where EXP given is lowered as Alucard levels up). A trivia about SOTN's bestiary is that there are enemies strong to water, although absolutely nothing in the game gives water damage. Castlevania: Harmony of Dissonance: the main differences is that in HOD, you need to pick up a relic called "Monster Tome" to be able to see the bestiary and the bestiary itself (called Encyclopedia) can be seen at the game's menu. EXP information is also useless on HOD since the game also uses the EXP degradation system. That was abandoned on all subsequent games. Castlevania: Aria of Sorrow: enemies are animated on the bestiary, and the game offers information about soul collection. Since Soma has the Soul Dominance power (can pick up enemies souls to use as powers), the bestiary shows a square called "soul" that will be marked if the enemie's soul was obtained, alongside darkening the enemy's name at the list. Castlevania: Lament of Innocence: the bestiary shows how much enemies were defeated at each entry. Castlevania: Dawn of Sorrow: you can see the bestiary at the upper screen of the DS, how much souls you got from each enemy and the soul rarity (how hard it is to make it drop). Castlevania: Curse of Darkness, Portrait of Ruin and Order of Ecclesia: more or less the same of other games, but bestiary is a "skill" obtained at Curse of Darkness. Considering how bestiary worked in the past, answer these QUESTIONS and discuss about Bloodstained's bestiary!
1) At some games, bestiary was a item obtained in-game in order for enemy information to be acessed. Would you like of Bloodstained also worked like that? If yes, what such item would be? A Key item? A Skill Shard? Something else?
2) Aside from the basic information that all bestiary from all Castlevanias had in the past (such as HP, level, EXP given, drop and shard drop, weakness and resistances, and enemy picture) would you like some additional information at the bestiary? Such as enemies parameters (STR, CON, etc) or something else?
3) How do you want Shard information to be shown at the bestiary BEFORE picking up such shard? Do you think it would be cool if the enemy shows some teasing information about it's drops and shard? For instance, instead of unknown drops being shown as a bunch of "??", it could be shown as something different, like "?? (weapon)" just for you to know, in advanve, what that drop would be. And / or maybe Shards could reveal their type before being picked up (instead of unknown shards being "??" they would be "?? (Trigger)" or "?? (familiar)". Or do you think such teasing would break a bit of the surprise?
4) Would you prefer if the bestiary shows a basic screenshot of the enemy, some fancy artwork, a 3d animation, maybe a cam where you can see enemy in detail or something else?
5) Bloodstained bestiary should be easily acessible from the menu, only at the game's shop / Johannes lair or some other kind of acess?
6) Symphony of the Night, IGA's biggest game, had 146 enemies. How much enemies do you expect Bloodstained (that had the "IGA's biggest castle" stretch goal achieved) to have?
That's all folks!
This thread was created based on Cale request on a discussion about bestiary. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
Deleted
inherit
guest@proboards.com
1794
0
Nov 23, 2024 11:03:15 GMT -6
Deleted
0
Nov 23, 2024 11:03:15 GMT -6
January 1970
Deleted
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2018 4:09:29 GMT -6
Mmm. Will bestiary be uncensored? Its artwork, i mean... Also, can we expect some nice hidden bonuses, like topless Succubus (the one in Sega Saturn Sotn files)?
|
|
XombieMike
Administrator
Fifty Storms 
Posts: 4,009
inherit
Administrator
236
0
1
Nov 22, 2024 8:42:49 GMT -6
4,236
XombieMike
4,009
Jul 8, 2015 7:10:22 GMT -6
July 2015
xombiemike
|
Post by XombieMike on Apr 26, 2018 7:57:25 GMT -6
I'd like it to be an expanded Ars Goetia, where the lore includes the symbols for the demons, their rank and the number of legions they command. For stuff that's not in the Goetia, just lore and normal stats, weaknesses, strengths, drops, etc.
|
|
Galamoth
Ancient Legion
Eternal Guardian
[TI2] Boss of the Floating Catacombs. Hopes nobody finds his hidden Beryl Circlet.
Posts: 3,402
inherit
Ancient Legion
195
0
Aug 19, 2023 8:35:43 GMT -6
2,620
Galamoth
[TI2] Boss of the Floating Catacombs. Hopes nobody finds his hidden Beryl Circlet.
3,402
Jun 24, 2015 13:36:33 GMT -6
June 2015
galamoth
|
Post by Galamoth on Apr 26, 2018 9:30:13 GMT -6
Time for more glorious green textTM. Yes! More questions to answer.
Let us begin!!
1) In some games, the bestiary was an item obtained in-game in order for enemy information to be accessed. Would you like if Bloodstained also worked like that? If yes, what kind of item would it be? A Key item? A Skill Shard? Something else? It would be a really cool concept if Miriam could instantly memorize every single important detail (and even lore) about a monster through the magic power of a Skill Shard, save for the need to obtain Drop items (unknown until collected).
2) Aside from the basic information in bestiaries that Castlevanias had in the past (such as HP, level, EXP given, drop and shard drop, weakness and resistances, and enemy picture) would you like some additional information at the bestiary? Such as enemies parameters (STR, CON, etc) or something else? ~ What type of Shard they yield (only after you've already absorbed one from them, if they have one).
~ Whether an enemy is capable of "GUARD" (no damage taken on certain parts of their body, or during certain attacks).
~ Type of Summon (if the enemy gives a Familiar Shard). Offensive (physical)? Healing? "Support"? Elemental, perhaps?
~ Adding onto what XombieMike posted, the rank [position in Hell] of each Ars Goetia-inspired Demon, listed in the Lesser Key of Solomon, could be used for important puzzles you might encounter. FOR EXAMPLE; Vepar is a "Great Duke", Gremory is a "Duke", and the Buer enemy is a "Great President".
3) How do you want Shard information to be shown at the bestiary BEFORE picking up such shard? Do you think it would be cool if the enemy shows some teasing information about it's drops and shard? For instance, instead of unknown drops being shown as a bunch of "??", it could be shown as something different, like "?? (weapon)" just for you to know, in advanve, what that drop would be. And / or maybe Shards could reveal their type before being picked up (instead of unknown shards being "??" they would be "?? (Trigger)" or "?? (familiar)". Or do you think such teasing would break a bit of the surprise? (This has already been partially answered in my reply to Question #2) I'd personally prefer whether it drops a Shard in the first place to remain "??" until after the enemy is defeated. If they evidently do drop a Shard, don't indicate what type until after you've already collected it.
4) Would you prefer if the bestiary shows a basic screenshot of the enemy, some fancy artwork, a 3d animation, maybe a cam where you can see enemy in detail or something else? Yes, though I don't care if 3D animated models or cam aren't used (save those for the main playable characters).5) Bloodstained's bestiary should be easily accessable from the menu, only at the game's shop / Johannes lair, or some other kind of access? Considering the idea posed in #1, I'd prefer it to be easily accessable from the menu (I assume you mean character/pause menu).6) Symphony of the Night, IGA's biggest game, had 146 enemies. How much enemies do you expect Bloodstained (that had the "IGA's biggest castle" stretch goal achieved) to have? It honestly depends on two factors: 1. How many original enemies will the developers create? 2. How many of the 72 Demons of the Ars Goetia will they draw from for enemies?^Based on all past Igavanias, I'm going to guess that the bare minimum of enemies we'll see in the game is 100. Maybe in the 120's.Looks like that's it for now!!
|
|
Nezuto
Master Alchemist
Welcome to my world....
Posts: 662
inherit
238
0
Jun 18, 2024 3:35:49 GMT -6
510
Nezuto
Welcome to my world....
662
Jul 8, 2015 12:18:42 GMT -6
July 2015
nezuto
|
Post by Nezuto on Apr 26, 2018 11:30:36 GMT -6
HEY!!!! I am NOT a weed  Edit: Also, I second what Galamoth said, as well. Was ready to write pretty much the same down, other than I feel like it's entirely possible we see upwards of 150 monsters/demons, given the scale of the game. I wouldn't mind seeing a thematic addition to the bestiary to fit into the style of the Ars Goetia, like having a toggle option for a short sequence to play whenever you open it to a particular page. Such as having the writing either suddenly appear as if by ghost writer or being 'burned' into the pages, as the static picture of the demon comes to life via a Runic Seal that breaks around them. This could also lend to gameplay if it were to be applied in such a way that, the more of that enemy you kill, the more information that unlocks, except that in this case, the more enemies you kill, the more of the seal that fades/breaks/weakens/what have you. |
|
inherit
1911
0
Oct 29, 2020 11:10:44 GMT -6
112
Arsenical
120
Jul 3, 2017 16:30:18 GMT -6
July 2017
arsenical
|
Post by Arsenical on Apr 26, 2018 14:50:18 GMT -6
AH! im heavily interested in this! (at this point, you should be getting paid for your posts.) 1) At some games, bestiary was a item obtained in-game in order for enemy information to be acessed. Would you like of Bloodstained also worked like that? If yes, what such item would be? A Key item? A Skill Shard? Something else? An item obtained from Johaness or from Dominique with a little dialogue involved, it would make a lot of sense and it would add a bit to bloodstained lore.
2) Aside from the basic information that all bestiary from all Castlevanias had in the past (such as HP, level, EXP given, drop and shard drop, weakness and resistances, and enemy picture) would you like some additional information at the bestiary? Such as enemies parameters (STR, CON, etc) or something else? i don't expect the game to have all 72 demons for different reasons and we already know that there will be many monsters that are not demons from the Ars Goetia. If theres something i want to see, that would be an actual monster lore or story and not just 2 lines of text that most of the time end up describing what we can already see such as: Man Eating plant - A plant that has a taste for human flesh. <--- no sh*t
take a look at the FFXII Bestiary, something like that + all the enemy data we had.
3) How do you want Shard information to be shown at the bestiary BEFORE picking up such shard? Do you think it would be cool if the enemy shows some teasing information about it's drops and shard? For instance, instead of unknown drops being shown as a bunch of "??", it could be shown as something different, like "?? (weapon)" just for you to know, in advanve, what that drop would be. And / or maybe Shards could reveal their type before being picked up (instead of unknown shards being "??" they would be "?? (Trigger)" or "?? (familiar)". Or do you think such teasing would break a bit of the surprise?
It should stay secret. its always fun to try to imagine what the shard is going to be like and sometimes its really troll when you see its a yellow shard that raises your stats or resistances and not the actual beam of massive destruction that the enemy used against you.
4) Would you prefer if the bestiary shows a basic screenshot of the enemy, some fancy artwork, a 3d animation, maybe a cam where you can see enemy in detail or something else? animated with zoom in option would be more than enough for me, honestly i care more about the enemy data and the artstyle of the bestiary.
5) Bloodstained bestiary should be easily acessible from the menu, only at the game's shop / Johannes lair or some other kind of acess?
pretty sure we will get that chance to open it whenever we want from the menu in the "Archives" option.
6) Symphony of the Night, IGA's biggest game, had 146 enemies. How much enemies do you expect Bloodstained (that had the "IGA's biggest castle" stretch goal achieved) to have?
 120 or less
its important to mention that most castlevania games had large bestiaries because they reused assets (sprites) several times in almost every game and that saved a lot of time and other resources. bloodstained its a completely new IP and all monsters need to be modeled from scratch, even if we talk about "familiar monsters" the devs still have to make them look different than those we saw in previous igavanias.
not only reused sprites but also palette swaps or small modifications, now i think we are going to have this in bloodstained as well, in the 2016 demo we got to see  (amy) an actual demon from the Ars goetia but "recently" we got the previews of the new buer familiar attacking a "ghost" monster that looks exactly like amy but it is red instead of blue.
now as for the 72 demons of the king Salomon honestly i don't think we get to see all of them for the following reasons:
- Many of them look a like. whats up with demons and lions? several of them are described to have similar aspect. unless the developers find an amazing way to make every single demon look unique without wandering to far from the actual lore, i don't see this happening.
- Not all demons are actually evil or beastly
- Some of them are... uninteresting? theres those that are important kings, presidents, dukes and theres those that are plain boring.
as for the other monsters, we have seen other interesting ideas such as the elementals and armor knights (they are back) and im almost certain that they are going to add monsters and beasts from other mythologies such as Arachne o Ctulhu.
no matter how many of these evil bast... we get, the more the merrier and im so ready to kill them 100+ times for that one item/shard missing in my bestiary.
 Amazing thread as always
|
|
Cale
Great Old One
Ancient Legion 
The world is indeed comic, but the joke is on mankind.
Posts: 624
inherit
Great Old One
58
0
Apr 8, 2021 18:19:41 GMT -6
791
Cale
The world is indeed comic, but the joke is on mankind.
624
Jun 11, 2015 3:45:35 GMT -6
June 2015
cale
|
Post by Cale on Apr 26, 2018 15:50:30 GMT -6
First off, thank you Pure Miriam for the insane amount of work you put into your posts, and second, thanks for the thread. NOW! Onto the good stuff! 1) At some games, bestiary was a item obtained in-game in order for enemy information to be acessed. Would you like of Bloodstained also worked like that? If yes, what such item would be? A Key item? A Skill Shard? Something else? Like others have said, I too would like the Bestiary to be a key item obtained from Johannes or Dominique, and it could be an expanded Ars Goetia. So you wouldn't have it right off the start, but it would be acquired, then accessed from your menu. Looking through some old footage there is a category in your menu called "Archives", my guess is this is where it will be located. 2) Aside from the basic information that all bestiary from all Castlevanias had in the past (such as HP, level, EXP given, drop and shard drop, weakness and resistances, and enemy picture) would you like some additional information at the bestiary? Such as enemies parameters (STR, CON, etc) or something else? I would love a little lore behind each enemy if possible. The rank of the Demon for example. Or maybe an animation of the shard in action after you unlock it. Beyond this I will answer more on question #4. 3) How do you want Shard information to be shown at the bestiary BEFORE picking up such shard? Do you think it would be cool if the enemy shows some teasing information about it's drops and shard? For instance, instead of unknown drops being shown as a bunch of "??", it could be shown as something different, like "?? (weapon)" just for you to know, in advanve, what that drop would be. And / or maybe Shards could reveal their type before being picked up (instead of unknown shards being "??" they would be "?? (Trigger)" or "?? (familiar)". Or do you think such teasing would break a bit of the surprise? I personally would like the shards to be a surprise. Although I wouldn't mind a symbol showing how rare the shard is, so you could expect how long it would take you to farm it. But once you have obtained the shard, it could fill in the Ars Goetia like a blue flame revealing writing, or blood, or some other nifty animation. 4) Would you prefer if the bestiary shows a basic screenshot of the enemy, some fancy artwork, a 3d animation, maybe a cam where you can see enemy in detail or something else? All of the above really. A still shot, 3d, rotatable, animated at the press of a button, zoom function. And even beyond that, I am getting the Art Book from backing, but it would be nice for others to have sketches or the like in the Bestiary as well. 5) Bloodstained bestiary should be easily acessible from the menu, only at the game's shop / Johannes lair or some other kind of acess? You could start off with it in the possession of Johannes or Dominique. They could hand it over to you, then you fill out the book with new information. So really you would be doing them a solid by expanding the Ars Goetia. 6) Symphony of the Night, IGA's biggest game, had 146 enemies. How much enemies do you expect Bloodstained (that had the "IGA's biggest castle" stretch goal achieved) to have? Tough question! I think I have to go with Arsenical on this one. It won't be the full Ars Goetia, but I am sure there will be enemies not found in there either. Soooo I am going with 150. Just to inch past SotN! Thanks again for the wonderful thread!  Edits: #2, forgot I would like a kill counter. |
|
inherit
2368
0
Aug 20, 2018 15:43:56 GMT -6
21
Jowy Avilon
[TI0]
27
Apr 15, 2018 19:01:16 GMT -6
April 2018
jowyavilon
|
Post by Jowy Avilon on Apr 26, 2018 16:55:06 GMT -6
5) Bloodstained bestiary should be easily acessible from the menu, only at the game's shop / Johannes lair or some other kind of acess? You could start off with it in the possession of Johannes or Dominique. They could hand it over to you, then you fill out the book with new information. So really you would be doing them a solid by expanding the Ars Goetia. This would be my main thing for it. For the one in BS, I would much rather it be accessible via the menu in game and not in a static location like it was in say SotN where the only way to view was to go back to the Librarian. I just don't wanna go out of my way to look at it. |
|
Astaroth
Fifty Storms
What a wonderful night to have a curse...
Posts: 1,213
inherit
57
0
Jan 4, 2022 11:47:39 GMT -6
1,368
Astaroth
What a wonderful night to have a curse...
1,213
Jun 10, 2015 20:22:05 GMT -6
June 2015
astaroth
|
Post by Astaroth on Apr 26, 2018 19:12:44 GMT -6
heres a random thought i had but what if you could get to bestiary from the map screen as well by hitting l1/r1, similar to how oot you can flip between items, quest, and map using l and r?
|
|
Cplus
New Blood
Posts: 61
inherit
1924
0
Jun 13, 2020 19:39:54 GMT -6
49
Cplus
61
Jul 24, 2017 11:44:08 GMT -6
July 2017
cplus
|
Post by Cplus on Apr 26, 2018 20:02:31 GMT -6
Wait a damn second, you're telling me that after over 10 years of playing SOTN that it has a bestiary? Whaaaat! I can't believe I never knew about it.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
Deleted
inherit
guest@proboards.com
1794
0
Nov 23, 2024 11:03:15 GMT -6
Deleted
0
Nov 23, 2024 11:03:15 GMT -6
January 1970
Deleted
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2018 20:19:06 GMT -6
Wait a damn second, you're telling me that after over 10 years of playing SOTN that it has a bestiary? Whaaaat! I can't believe I never knew about it. Not only that, but Sotn's bestiary is also like a "collectible", or an "achievement" of sorts, to complete fully. Some enemies can be missed permanently and dropped items, register under enemy entries, only if and when you find them. There was also that capes' colors menu, the record of bosses beaten at what gameplay time, etc. Getting all the menus in Sotn and completed, too, was a real challenge and a drag. Well, not exactly a drag, but certainly, a time consuming ordeal. |
|
Astaroth
Fifty Storms
What a wonderful night to have a curse...
Posts: 1,213
inherit
57
0
Jan 4, 2022 11:47:39 GMT -6
1,368
Astaroth
What a wonderful night to have a curse...
1,213
Jun 10, 2015 20:22:05 GMT -6
June 2015
astaroth
|
Post by Astaroth on Apr 26, 2018 22:00:02 GMT -6
i cant think of any missable enemies, however there are some that you cant fill in unless you do something specific like needing to library card out of the drac fight to get him and shaft |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
Deleted
inherit
guest@proboards.com
1794
0
Nov 23, 2024 11:03:15 GMT -6
Deleted
0
Nov 23, 2024 11:03:15 GMT -6
January 1970
Deleted
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2018 22:51:57 GMT -6
i cant think of any missable enemies, however there are some that you cant fill in unless you do something specific like needing to library card out of the drac fight to get him and shaft Mudman. Most runs end up with never registering the damned thing. Richter. You have to hit him at least once, before breaking the orb. Wargs. Okay, this one you have to try hard, in order to miss. |
|
Cale
Great Old One
Ancient Legion
The world is indeed comic, but the joke is on mankind.
Posts: 624
inherit
Great Old One
58
0
Apr 8, 2021 18:19:41 GMT -6
791
Cale
The world is indeed comic, but the joke is on mankind.
624
Jun 11, 2015 3:45:35 GMT -6
June 2015
cale
|
Post by Cale on Apr 26, 2018 23:10:12 GMT -6
Ya, I usually killed the enemy before he could summon Mudman |
|
Pure Miriam
Legendary Comrade
Shardbinder
[TI1] "A new, vital heart, pulsing with the old blood." -IGA
Posts: 1,068
inherit
Legendary Comrade
445
0
Oct 20, 2019 3:32:00 GMT -6
1,600
Pure Miriam
[TI1] "A new, vital heart, pulsing with the old blood." -IGA
1,068
Jul 25, 2015 2:19:20 GMT -6
July 2015
puremiriam
|
Post by Pure Miriam on Apr 27, 2018 2:02:53 GMT -6
Wait a damn second, you're telling me that after over 10 years of playing SOTN that it has a bestiary? Whaaaat! I can't believe I never knew about it. Hahah, yes, the bestiary started on SOTN, it's at the library. As you can see by the picture, an option called "Enemy List". It's quite impressive you missed that. |
|
hellmont
New Blood
@the_irregulars
Posts: 39
inherit
2109
0
Jan 31, 2020 14:37:54 GMT -6
16
hellmont
@the_irregulars
39
Oct 3, 2017 16:11:16 GMT -6
October 2017
hellmont
|
Post by hellmont on Apr 27, 2018 7:32:21 GMT -6
I'd like the bestiary to be accessible from the pause menu. However, if it's a shop menu only kinda thing...  |
|
120 or less 
(amy) an actual demon from the Ars goetia but "recently" we got the previews of the new buer familiar attacking a "ghost" monster that looks exactly like amy but it is red instead of blue. 
Amazing thread as always 
quack
yey