Enkeria
Silver in the Dark
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Amzeer - Aurora of Rebirth
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Post by Enkeria on Mar 23, 2018 14:19:10 GMT -6
What do you guys feel about the Amy / Ghost monster?
Its a color-shade between them, and perhaps one have more health than the other. It seems like they use same pattern of movement but unsure about their attacks.
Amy were in the E3 demo for the backers, 1st edition on Galleon Minerva. Ghost were in the new footage from SXSW 2018.
Do you think / hope they are same in everything except "level" or "tier"? Like one is more aggressive than the other? Or do you think / hope each new "colored enemy" of the same, have different aspects, movements and skills attached to them? For example Amy have an homing projectile that hunts you down for a while, would Ghost instead shoot the same but also multiply itself so you get surrounded faster? Or perhaps shoot faster, or more projectiles like a spread-shoot?
Thoughts?
Amy footage 9 min and 14 sec in:
Ghost can be seen 41 min in:
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akuwa
New Blood
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Post by akuwa on Mar 23, 2018 15:43:59 GMT -6
I always like enemies to be unique and games with too many enemies that are the same just recolored I usually criticize them for it so I do prefer unique aspect to each of the variants such as different attacks and aggro ranges.
Amy's in particular have a bigger issue of lacking attacks in general from what they have shown so far, it's like they are peaceful birds rather than menacing ghosts. a good way to fix that would be to make them lack a physical form altogether so that physical attacks would pass straight through them and to harm them you would need to use any type of magic and then to make that enemy type unique and then each variant could apply a different status effect to you on hit.
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Post by Valtiel on Mar 23, 2018 15:48:25 GMT -6
I don't mind reskins as long as the game doesn't rely on them too heavily. Phantasy Star Online did it well, where the basic "Booma" enemies were reskinned for 3 of the 4 areas but every other monster was unique.
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Post by CastleDan on Mar 23, 2018 23:40:33 GMT -6
I said this in discord but are we sure they didn't just rename it entirely? I mean they might have just liked naming it Ghost over Amy.
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Post by mourningxsun on Mar 24, 2018 0:06:12 GMT -6
It's been a thing in every single igavania so I'm not all that concerned.
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Pure Miriam
Legendary Comrade
Shardbinder
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Post by Pure Miriam on Mar 24, 2018 2:05:34 GMT -6
Yeah, i also noticed ghost, quickly, in there, and it really looks like what we call a "pallete swap". CastleDan i don't believe it was just renamed because Amy is one of the demons from Ars Goeatia and IGA said he was going to use all of them. Due to that, i do believe it's two different enemies. But, if Amy was renamed to Ghost, then there will be a new enemy called Amy somewhere else. Now, pallete swap is something really old that still happens to this day, abeit in a more sophisticated form. In the sprite era, all you did was take a graphic, change it's color, give the enemy a different name and parameters and that's it, you have a new enemy. Nowadays, specially on 3D, there are other methods to do that. You can take the same middle-age soldier, give him a shield and change his moves and you have a new enemy that, in reality, is a "glorified" pallete swap of another enemy. Igavanias always had that, because pallete swap is a way to cut costs and time on creating enemies. I don't mind that, as long as it isn't overused. I do hope they try to do the "new generation Pallete Swap" as i said above, by not only recoloring an enemy, but also giving it different moves and behavior, yeah. But from the very little that can be seen in the video, it really does like Ghost is just Amy with a new color. Also, if that is the game's entrance, then it means the game will have a pallete swap enemy right in the beginning? That isn't a good sight. Let's see how it turns out. |
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Post by freddythemonkey on Mar 24, 2018 3:35:45 GMT -6
I prefer as little palette swap as possible. It has been in other games of the series, but sometimes they kinda went overboard with it (Circle of the Moon, which isn't an IGAvania to be fair, had like fifty bazillion armors and skeletons, it changed the sprites a little bit but come on man there were way too many lol; Harmony had to an extent the same problem), so I'd like for them to keep the whole thing to a minimum.
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Enkeria
Silver in the Dark
Fifty Storms
Amzeer - Aurora of Rebirth
Posts: 1,908
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Silver in the Dark
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Enkeria
Amzeer - Aurora of Rebirth
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Post by Enkeria on Mar 24, 2018 12:31:10 GMT -6
Innovate a new IP
Do you think those two are different in any way other than colors? Colors and health was the two thing they usually had in some Castlevania games, while some really changed the animations / weapons and skills on others. For example Axe Knight. Walked the same, had same design on its armor, but had different weapons and animations.
If there is an blue Amy, I would suggest making any Amy Version 2 to be different, just not only in color, but in movement and attack.
So the question is, do you think this is the case? Or just a "plain color-swap and change in resistance / higher health" only, or not?
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Pure Miriam
Legendary Comrade
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Post by Pure Miriam on Mar 25, 2018 3:11:57 GMT -6
To be fair, i believe Ghost and Amy are two different enemies that are just pallete swap one another. They may have different parameters, weaknesses and such, but nothing more than that. But i do believe Bloodstained will take more or less the same approach as some of the later Igavanias did, by combining pallete swap with different powers or animations. I just can't see that on Ghost and Amy, specially due to how little information we have on Ghost. So, i think Bloodstained will try to do what some other Igavanias did, but that's not the case with Ghost. There is a chance that Amy changed completely. Buer had a basic "CON Booster" Enchant Shard and now it gives a Familiar Shard. So, changes are being made all the time. Really hard to speculate. The whole Shard thing is what makes me more curious, actually. Aria of Sorrow and Dawn of Sorrow, the main games where Shard System came from, had Souls (powers) for 100% of it's enemies, but it seems Bloodstained will not do that (since Morte has no Shard). I'm also thinking if most of those weaker / smaller / fodder enemies will be the ones to not have a shard. Amy became "a bit famous" at the E3 2016 Demo for being the hardest shard to drop (1% chance) and being the closest we had for a "familiar" in that Demo (being a summoned demon). I don't think they will change that. So, maybe Ghost will be the one with no Shard? What are the criteria the Dev team has to choose who deserves a Shard and who doesn't? What is hardest to create? I believe they are trying to avoid what happened in Aria / Dawn, where, the fact all enemies have Shards forced them to create a lot of useless / subpar powers. Tons of basic parameter's boosters and demon summoning because it was easier. That is something you need to considerate when talking about pallete swaps too. Let's imagine Bone Thrower has a Pallete Swap. Bone Thrower's shard is quite unique (throwing bones by aiming their directions), what you would with a Bone Thrower Pallete swap enemy? Throw a different bone? Not giving it a Shard? Those are things to think about too. If Amy and Ghost are the same enemy, different colors (a complete pallete swap one another), what kind of Shard Ghost would give? the new host to CON Booster?  |
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