Crafting: 12 questions!

Pure Miriam
Legendary Comrade
Shardbinder

[TI1] "A new, vital heart, pulsing with the old blood." -IGA

Posts: 1,068

Crafting: 12 questions! Feb 1, 2018 4:37:35 GMT -6

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Post by Pure Miriam on Feb 1, 2018 4:37:35 GMT -6

1 Thorn Whip crafted? Thorn Whip x1 crafted?

The newest Bloodstained update (HERE) presented us with the game's crafting system. It looks simple and efficient. Gather material, forge that material, and you get new stuff. Considering what was revealed and our own expectations for it. Answer the questions below!

1) Did you liked Bloodstained crafting system, considering what we know so far?

2) The crafting system has a list of things that you can craft. That means you cannot craft something just by having the materials to do it, you need to have what you want to create, on that list. How do you think that list is going to be updated? By finding new "recipes"? By leveling up Miriam? By progressing in the game? By finding relevant materials that would add new things to the list?

3) Some itens require other itens (not just materials) to be crafted. High Potion and High Ether requires Potion and Ether to be crafted, while Lohengrin, Schedar and Lightning Bolt requires Gram (a type of Sword, a mythological one). That can create a convoluted system where you need to find A to craft B and use the crafted B to create a C. What do you think of that? Fun because it makes you grind, search and find more stuff, or boring because you need to many things to reach the result you want?

4) In the past, IGA said that he wanted the game's drops to be related to enemy parts, such as head, body, etc. Some of the materials there seen to be generic, such as Melted Skull or Tail. Do you want materials to follow some kind of logic (like, any enemy with a tail, should have a chance to drop the generic "tail" material, any enemy with a skull should drop some kind of skull) or w0uld you prefer if the game had materials scatered around enemies without the need to follow a rigid logic behind it?

5) The sword Schedar requires "Vepar Fangs" to be crafted. Vepar is a boss. Do you think bosses will drop materials for crafting? If that's so, how that will work out? They will have 100% chance of dropping (since they are bosses and usually fought only once), or maybe bosses that CAN be normal enemies later on could have a normal drop rate? Or the game could have some kind of system to summon bosses again to fight them and make them drop their stuff?

6) Regarding drop rates, what do you expect or want, regarding materials? Low or high drop chances overall? Also, would you like to find materials scatered around the game, inside chests and such? As prize for quests, among other ways to obtain them?

7) This updated also presented us with a new bat-like enemy (without official name yet). Do you think that enemy will have a shard? If yes, what type and how it would be?

8) The options menu that quickly shows in the crafting system, shows cooking and shards (and also something that looks like dismantle itens). Regarding cooking, do you think the game may end up being too easy if it has several potions and food types, considering the game's cap for itens seems to be 99?

9) Regarding Shards, how do you think they will integrate into the crafting system? Adding up Shards to level themselves up? Maybe using them to give special effects to weapons and equipment? Or maybe, using Shards to create totally new ones?

10) Regarding the last option in the menu, that LOOKS LIKE dismantling, what do you think of it? Would you like if the game had, like, a very rare material that can only be obtained by dismantling a very rare piece of equipment or something like that?

11) Do you think that, with the crafting system, the game may turn into a "grind feast" in order to obtain materials needed to craft things as quickly as possible? What would be the outcomes of this?

12) Crafting should be optional? (everything you can craft, you would be able to find in the game, abeit in a harder way).

That's all folks!

Last Edit: Feb 1, 2018 4:46:10 GMT -6 by Pure Miriam

I consider Igavania and Metroidvania the same genre, but i call" IGAVANIA" if the game was created, directed or with some involvement of Koji Igarashi OR the game closely follows his path on "Metroidvania Gothic game" style.

Enkeria
Silver in the Dark
Fifty Storms

Amzeer - Aurora of Rebirth

Posts: 1,908

Crafting: 12 questions! Feb 1, 2018 7:39:58 GMT -6

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Post by Enkeria on Feb 1, 2018 7:39:58 GMT -6

Did you liked Bloodstained crafting system, considering what we know so far?

Seems solid, I questioned a lot of it, but there are a few solutions to every question I have asked myself so far, so its a nice feature. And it seems to still be an end-game feature, which you can invest some time into after exploring at your own pace.

The crafting system has a list of things that you can craft. How do you think that list is going to be updated?

Recipes, it would be additional drop from enemies. I guess the basic crafting would be by you leveling Miriam to a low point, and perhaps by killing bosses - trigger some updates too.

Some items require other items (not just materials) to be crafted. What do you think of that? Fun because it makes you grind, search and find more stuff, or boring because you need to many things to reach the result you want?

Its an addition to your journey. Good to have, but do not need it if you are more into exploring. Finding potions should be a thing for even the casual player, but during nightmare difficulty, this could be something you feel you want to have, but only as a way to make the game easier. I guess it makes you feel a little more in control, and options are welcome.

Do you want materials to follow some kind of logic?

I believe some enemies drop special items, lesser enemies mostly, but also bigger powerful ones which is exclusive, and bodyparts that belongs to them. It will make you grind if you know what you are after, but crafting could be an end-game feature, I think there is a high chance you would have the materials once you find the weapon or armor that you have in mind which you want to upgrade. Perhaps you need to also upgrade a tome or book so you can look after enemies which might have what you need.

The sword Schedar requires "Vepar Fangs" to be crafted. Vepar is a boss. Do you think bosses will drop materials for crafting?

Vepar Fangs are probably not from the boss Vepar, but Vepar-beings. It could also be a placeholder-name. I do not see you getting materials from bosses, only shards and as an additional reward in some cases - an item or ability. I think just Fang was too generic to be used.

Regarding drop rates, what do you expect or want, regarding materials? Low or high drop chances overall? Also, would you like to find materials scatered around the game, inside chests and such? As prize for quests, among other ways to obtain them?

Low drop chance. But it would be really interesting to find bags or piles from chests or monsters which needs to be sorted at Johannes place, like a mixed bag of materials and ingredients. These bags would have random materials, and a % chance to get certain things. Like a small boost of items a few times during your journey.

This updated also presented us with a new bat-like enemy (without official name yet). Do you think that enemy will have a shard? If yes, what type and how it would be?

I do not think it will have a shard. And I believe the bat was in Mana Ikedas art.

The options menu that quickly shows in the crafting system, shows cooking and shards (and also something that looks like dismantle itens). Regarding cooking, do you think the game may end up being too easy if it has several potions and food types, considering the game's cap for itens seems to be 99?

No, you need to sacrifice things to gain things. It will be somewhat balanced. Probably with exceptions which could be patched at a later date if needed.

Regarding Shards, how do you think they will integrate into the crafting system? Adding up Shards to level themselves up? Maybe using them to give special effects to weapons and equipment? Or maybe, using Shards to create totally new ones?

At first glance.. Just to level up. But there could be some shards that worked similar to Castlevania where you need rib of vlad, eye of vlad etc. And by combining those special shards, you gain something out of it. These special shards could work as both active or passive ones and still do even after being combined, its just like a puzzle.

Regarding the last option in the menu, that LOOKS LIKE dismantling, what do you think of it? Would you like if the game had, like, a very rare material that can only be obtained by dismantling a very rare piece of equipment or something like that?

Salvage, return item to its original form. Simple as that. I worried it would just destroy a weapon or armor in front of your eyes, but the IGA way is to have fun, and loosing an item like that is never fun. So I think it just is another fancy thing to revert back to the basic items and materials you found. Example would be that the thorn whip would become a normal whip and those things you needed to make a thorn whip also returned (or not).

Do you think that, with the crafting system, the game may turn into a "grind feast" in order to obtain materials needed to craft things as quickly as possible? What would be the outcomes of this?

Only if you are in for the crafting and not the exploration itself, which is the selling point here. I think after people have told how easy / hard it is, changed could be made. I really hope its just numbers they can poke at if needed, like % chance or something.

Crafting should be optional? (everything you can craft, you would be able to find in the game, abeit in a harder way).

I think that crafting just works as a softer curve / bridge between the items you find by exploration. The levels in between items. Not to talk about actual numbers here, but just for the sake of this explanation: You find a level 1 sword, now you find a level 2 whip, now a level 3 axe, now you find Johannes, you can upgrade sword to level 4. Great! Now it feels better than the axe if you are more into speed than power. If you do not upgrade, you just happens to find a level 5 spear soon enough. So in a sense, its optional, it just becomes a bridge in between items.

Many questions, and short of answers. I wonder if we can find it all too, or we can only find the base-items, which can be (not necessarily become stronger, but..) different with crafting. So a Sword could become fire, or ice, or electric depending on materials, but the base-damage is exactly the same. The elements just is strong vs whatever you might come across.

There are many ways to go with the crafting.

My other thoughts: bloodstainedfanforums.com/post/52382

Galamoth
Ancient Legion
Eternal Guardian

[TI2] Boss of the Floating Catacombs. Hopes nobody finds his hidden Beryl Circlet.

Posts: 3,402

Crafting: 12 questions! Feb 1, 2018 10:54:54 GMT -6 JeffCross likes this

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Post by Galamoth on Feb 1, 2018 10:54:54 GMT -6

How glad I am that there are more questions to answer! This will be fun. Answers in glorious green text^TM.

1) Did you liked Bloodstained crafting system, considering what we know so far?

It's a vague reminder that we actually did have crafting systems of-sorts in two past Igavanias, so I'm cool with it.

2) The crafting system has a list of things that you can craft. That means you cannot craft something just by having the materials to do it, you need to have what you want to create, on that list. How do you think that list is going to be updated? By finding new "recipes"? By leveling up Miriam? By progressing in the game? By finding relevant materials that would add new things to the list?

I imagine it would be the latter (simply finding new materials would add options to the list). After all, it's not necessarily Miriam that's learning how to perform crafting with alchemy. She's using Johannes' skill as an alchemist to service her crafting need.

3) Some items require other items (not just materials) to be crafted. High Potion and High Ether requires Potion and Ether to be crafted, while Lohengrin, Schedar and Lightning Bolt requires Gram (a type of Sword, a mythological one). That can create a convoluted system where you need to find A to craft B and use the crafted B to create a C. What do you think of that? Fun because it makes you grind, search and find more stuff, or boring because you need to many things to reach the result you want?

I wouldn't call it "convoluted". This system requiring you to relinquish certain items/equipment you may have found in your travels in order to get something [ideally] better is pretty standard by now.

4) In the past, IGA said that he wanted the game's drops to be related to enemy parts, such as head, body, etc. Some of the materials there seen to be generic, such as Melted Skull or Tail. Do you want materials to follow some kind of logic (like, any enemy with a tail, should have a chance to drop the generic "tail" material, any enemy with a skull should drop some kind of skull) or w0uld you prefer if the game had materials scatered around enemies without the need to follow a rigid logic behind it?

It ultimately doesn't matter to me what exactly each enemy drops, as I imagine not all of them will necessarily be body parts. I'm almost certain that Shards could be required for a few recipes if you wanted to add elemental magic properties to a weapon or armor.

5) The sword Schedar requires "Vepar Fangs" to be crafted. Vepar is a boss. Do you think bosses will drop materials for crafting? If that's so, how that will work out? They will have 100% chance of dropping (since they are bosses and usually fought only once), or maybe bosses that CAN be normal enemies later on could have a normal drop rate? Or the game could have some kind of system to summon bosses again to fight them and make them drop their stuff?

This is my big question too. So far, it doesn't look like we'll be fighting any Boss as "normal enemies" later in the game.

6) Regarding drop rates, what do you expect or want, regarding materials? Low or high drop chances overall? Also, would you like to find materials scatered around the game, inside chests and such? As prize for quests, among other ways to obtain them?

I think Crafting Materials in general are likely to have higher drop chances than equipment or items. I imagine that since Curse of Darkness hid special crafting materials in parts of the world, Bloodstained will do it again.

7) This updated also presented us with a new bat-like enemy (without official name yet). Do you think that enemy will have a shard? If yes, what type and how it would be?

It doesn't look like it has a shard embedded in its body, so maybe not. Then again, since Bloodless evidently gives a Shard upon defeat, I'm not sure enemies need to look like they have crystals on their body to possess a Shard.

8) The options menu that quickly shows in the crafting system, shows cooking and shards (and also something that looks like dismantle items). Regarding cooking, do you think the game may end up being too easy if it has several potions and food types, considering the game's cap for items seems to be 99?

I haven't seen any indication that the Item Cap is 99, but if Order of Ecclesia was any indication, I think the amount of curative items you have won't be that effective of a crutch in a difficult boss-fight. Adapt to the enemies you fight, or risk wasting all of your Potions.

9) Regarding Shards, how do you think they will integrate into the crafting system? Adding up Shards to level themselves up? Maybe using them to give special effects to weapons and equipment? Or maybe, using Shards to create totally new ones?

I'd say both your 2nd & 3rd suggestions are reasonable to expect. If I wanted a Whip of Ice that also Curses enemies, I'd probably expect Shards to be involved in the crafting process.

10) Regarding the last option in the menu, that LOOKS LIKE dismantling, what do you think of it? Would you like if the game had, like, a very rare material that can only be obtained by dismantling a very rare piece of equipment or something like that?

It would certainly be nice to have that as an option.

11) Do you think that, with the crafting system, the game may turn into a "grind fest" in order to obtain materials needed to craft things as quickly as possible? What would be the outcomes of this?

Depends on your playstyle. Then there's the fact that some of this game's most powerful weapons won't require crafting (or so I've heard); they'll either be bought at a Shop or found in the Castle.

12) Crafting should be optional? (everything you can craft, you would be able to find in the game, abeit in a harder way).

I don't think every single item/equipment you could possibly craft could also be found by exploration, or bought at a shop, but I DO still think Crafting will be optional.

That shall be all my answers for now!

Curse you, Alucard!

Devin R. Lowe from the Bloodstained Kickstarter page.

chronogeran
Fifty Storms

Posts: 29

Crafting: 12 questions! Feb 1, 2018 11:01:32 GMT -6 JeffCross and Galamoth like this

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Post by chronogeran on Feb 1, 2018 11:01:32 GMT -6

1) Did you liked Bloodstained crafting system, considering what we know so far?

Yeah. It's pretty standard, just combine things to get other things. I think it's fine.

2) The crafting system has a list of things that you can craft. That means you cannot craft something just by having the materials to do it, you need to have what you want to create, on that list. How do you think that list is going to be updated? By finding new "recipes"? By leveling up Miriam? By progressing in the game? By finding relevant materials that would add new things to the list?

I don't want to have to find recipes for everything. My preferred method would be that when you find materials you see what you can make with them, and what else you need to complete it. Not necessarily everything all at once -- maybe some recipes are concealed until you find the more relevant/rare ingredients of them. I think Curse of Darkness worked like this?

3) Some itens require other itens (not just materials) to be crafted. High Potion and High Ether requires Potion and Ether to be crafted, while Lohengrin, Schedar and Lightning Bolt requires Gram (a type of Sword, a mythological one). That can create a convoluted system where you need to find A to craft B and use the crafted B to create a C. What do you think of that? Fun because it makes you grind, search and find more stuff, or boring because you need to many things to reach the result you want?

I like the crafting chains, as long as they're not too obnoxious. One thing I didn't like about Curse of Darkness was the missable materials from stealing from bosses, etc. A little grinding is okay, but I get fed up with it pretty quickly. The amount of grinding that was present in Order of Ecclesia, for example, was just fine with me. I want the bulk of the play time in the game to be about discovering, experiencing, being challenged, rather than grinding.

4) In the past, IGA said that he wanted the game's drops to be related to enemy parts, such as head, body, etc. Some of the materials there seen to be generic, such as Melted Skull or Tail. Do you want materials to follow some kind of logic (like, any enemy with a tail, should have a chance to drop the generic "tail" material, any enemy with a skull should drop some kind of skull) or w0uld you prefer if the game had materials scatered around enemies without the need to follow a rigid logic behind it?

I would prefer a pretty rigid logic, I think, because it would help it feel more immersive. Needing to kill enemies in certain ways (or cut off certain parts while they're still alive) could be pretty fun. Especially if you know enough about what you're going for, rather than not even knowing that you're still missing parts from a certain enemy. But a more generic system would be fine too.

5) The sword Schedar requires "Vepar Fangs" to be crafted. Vepar is a boss. Do you think bosses will drop materials for crafting? If that's so, how that will work out? They will have 100% chance of dropping (since they are bosses and usually fought only once), or maybe bosses that CAN be normal enemies later on could have a normal drop rate? Or the game could have some kind of system to summon bosses again to fight them and make them drop their stuff?

That's a good question. Whatever the answer, I just want nothing missable. If you can only get one Vepar Fangs, then it should be a 100% drop rate and only used in one recipe. But early-game bosses becoming normal enemies is a common choice, and I like it. It helps you feel like you've become much stronger. Some system to re-fight bosses could be fun too, as long as I don't have to do it 20 times.

6) Regarding drop rates, what do you expect or want, regarding materials? Low or high drop chances overall? Also, would you like to find materials scatered around the game, inside chests and such? As prize for quests, among other ways to obtain them?

I'd prefer generally high drop rates, but not too high, with only the few rarest materials having roughly sub-3% rates (depending on the difficulty of killing the given monster as well). And yeah, I think they should show up in chests, quests etc. too.

7) This updated also presented us with a new bat-like enemy (without official name yet). Do you think that enemy will have a shard? If yes, what type and how it would be?

I think it will. Probably a pretty weak one, similar to the bat soul in Dawn of Sorrow.

8) The options menu that quickly shows in the crafting system, shows cooking and shards (and also something that looks like dismantle itens). Regarding cooking, do you think the game may end up being too easy if it has several potions and food types, considering the game's cap for itens seems to be 99?

Eh, not necessarily. They could very well balance it so that the healing provided doesn't make the game too easy. And even if it did, I could see myself just not using healing items if I feel like I don't need them. That's the way I've been playing CrossCode - no use of consumbales. Having a 99 item cap doesn't mean it will be easy to get 99 of something. Also, it may be that some of the same materials are used for cooking as are used for equipment crafting, and so you could have a trade-off of whether you want healing items or you want to save them for equipment. The previous Igavanias did a good job of balancing healing items, so I think it will work out.

9) Regarding Shards, how do you think they will integrate into the crafting system? Adding up Shards to level themselves up? Maybe using them to give special effects to weapons and equipment? Or maybe, using Shards to create totally new ones?

This is a really interesting one. You could create shards from non-shard materials (unlikely). You could use shards to create non-shard items/equipment (also not very likely -- but I like it). I think the most likely route is that you use shards to make different shards. So some shards would have to be crafted instead of found from enemies. I think this will be fun. I would prefer it over simple stacking/leveling up.

10) Regarding the last option in the menu, that LOOKS LIKE dismantling, what do you think of it? Would you like if the game had, like, a very rare material that can only be obtained by dismantling a very rare piece of equipment or something like that?

I like the dismantling idea. It gives you options on whether you want money for selling junk equipment or the materials that come from it. I also like the idea of dismantling rare equipment as the only way to get certain materials. But I'd rather not have to dismantle anything that you can only get ONCE.

11) Do you think that, with the crafting system, the game may turn into a "grind feast" in order to obtain materials needed to craft things as quickly as possible? What would be the outcomes of this?

I hope not. I tend to save my grinding for after I beat the game, if I really like it, to fill out my completion books. If I don't get equipment during the normal course of play, fine. I'll get what I need to win. I think grinding is, by definition, a boring way to play a game. Sometimes it's okay, but it's not where the meat is. But I also believe in giving people the freedom to play the way they want. I just hope the game doesn't encourage too much grinding.

12) Crafting should be optional? (everything you can craft, you would be able to find in the game, abeit in a harder way).

Crafting should be optional, but I'm totally fine with some items being exclusive to crafting. They're not necessary to win and have a good time, but they're necessary to get 100% of items.

Thanks for your topic, Pure Miriam! I always enjoy the thought you put into them!

JeffCross
Shadow of the Night
Ancient Legion

[TI0] Die monster!!!!!!

Posts: 1,365

Crafting: 12 questions! Feb 1, 2018 13:08:53 GMT -6 chronogeran likes this

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Post by JeffCross on Feb 1, 2018 13:08:53 GMT -6

1) Did you liked Bloodstained crafting system, considering what we know so far?

it was ok... it's more like CoD then I really wanted. I wish it was more in depth... to be able to make weapons with trial and error... but again this is not a forging game lol so I understand why its not that deep.

2) The crafting system has a list of things that you can craft. That means you cannot craft something just by having the materials to do it, you need to have what you want to create, on that list. How do you think that list is going to be updated? By finding new "recipes"? By leveling up Miriam? By progressing in the game? By finding relevant materials that would add new things to the list?

As I said it's very much like CoD... in that game if you have the material, the final product can be seen in the forging menu.

3) Some itens require other itens (not just materials) to be crafted. High Potion and High Ether requires Potion and Ether to be crafted, while Lohengrin, Schedar and Lightning Bolt requires Gram (a type of Sword, a mythological one). That can create a convoluted system where you need to find A to craft B and use the crafted B to create a C. What do you think of that? Fun because it makes you grind, search and find more stuff, or boring because you need to many things to reach the result you want?

I think some of those items will be common drops later in the game... but whether it's fun or not... meh... I really wanted a deeper forging system so... again... meh... and I agree with chronogeran please don't have the "steal" ability it was so annoying... I almost didn't finish the game because I NEEDED to steal some items... then I said F**k it I am just gonna finish the game.

4) In the past, IGA said that he wanted the game's drops to be related to enemy parts, such as head, body, etc. Some of the materials there seen to be generic, such as Melted Skull or Tail. Do you want materials to follow some kind of logic (like, any enemy with a tail, should have a chance to drop the generic "tail" material, any enemy with a skull should drop some kind of skull) or w0uld you prefer if the game had materials scatered around enemies without the need to follow a rigid logic behind it?

Personally I think it should be logical... like you get fur from werewolves... scales from fish or lizards etc... maybe you can make a rare head item drop by hitting its head, attack its legs to get a leg/feet drop and normal body shots to get the standard body drop... (I don't know how you can make hand or arm things drop faster)

5) The sword Schedar requires "Vepar Fangs" to be crafted. Vepar is a boss. Do you think bosses will drop materials for crafting? If that's so, how that will work out? They will have 100% chance of dropping (since they are bosses and usually fought only once), or maybe bosses that CAN be normal enemies later on could have a normal drop rate? Or the game could have some kind of system to summon bosses again to fight them and make them drop their stuff?

The most logical sense to do this is though boss rush mode... but I really wish they would do a summon system... so the boss rooms won't be useless rooms anymore.

6) Regarding drop rates, what do you expect or want, regarding materials? Low or high drop chances overall? Also, would you like to find materials scatered around the game, inside chests and such? As prize for quests, among other ways to obtain them?

Well I think they will have drops based on rarity (not the pony lol) the rarer the item the harder it is to get... I would not want to kill something and get something every time I think that would get boring... and yeah having monster parts would be nice... but the ones you find in a chest should be parts or items you could only get later in the game not common drops... nothing pisses me off more then reaching a chest and it has a small potion in it... or something even more useless... if its in a chest it should be worth getting.

7) This updated also presented us with a new bat-like enemy (without official name yet). Do you think that enemy will have a shard? If yes, what type and how it would be?

I hope its a summon... and like SotN the more it levels up the more tiny bats you get...

8) The options menu that quickly shows in the crafting system, shows cooking and shards (and also something that looks like dismantle itens). Regarding cooking, do you think the game may end up being too easy if it has several potions and food types, considering the game's cap for itens seems to be 99?

I just hope cooking is not like the forging system and you can add buffs to your food... I think really powerful healing items will be capped at like 5 or if its a full heal maybe 2-3.

9) Regarding Shards, how do you think they will integrate into the crafting system? Adding up Shards to level themselves up? Maybe using them to give special effects to weapons and equipment? Or maybe, using Shards to create totally new ones?

It would be cool if there is a hidden shard you have to make... Oooh idea! you know we are gonna get palette swaps of enemies (my assumption) what of we can combine the shards of like enemies to make the ultimate version of that shard.

also what if you have to break open shards to get magi crystals or some kind of rare marital from them?

10) Regarding the last option in the menu, that LOOKS LIKE dismantling, what do you think of it? Would you like if the game had, like, a very rare material that can only be obtained by dismantling a very rare piece of equipment or something like that?

I would like that... if there is an item that is rare, something you cannot forge... you can only get it through a rare enemy drop... than that would be cool. but if it is a one of a kind item in the game then no I hate that.

11) Do you think that, with the crafting system, the game may turn into a "grind feast" in order to obtain materials needed to craft things as quickly as possible? What would be the outcomes of this?

Yes the game will turn into a grind fest for those people who want to make every weapon in the game... but I think that will be a choice... (continued in the next question)

12) Crafting should be optional? (everything you can craft, you would be able to find in the game, abeit in a harder way).

Iga-sama likes adding extras to make a game fun but I don't think it is necessary to even touch the forging system if you don't want to bother. it is just something for us to do while in the game.

Last Edit: Feb 1, 2018 13:32:07 GMT -6 by JeffCross

Secrets and dishonesty are burdens, easily avoided by the truth.

allooutrick
Loyal Familiar

Posts: 334

Crafting: 12 questions! Feb 1, 2018 13:56:16 GMT -6 via mobile

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Post by allooutrick on Feb 1, 2018 13:56:16 GMT -6

1) yes
2) it's probably tied to story and the limitations of Johannes knowledge. He might have a book or two to read while Miriam advances the story
3) I'm in favor of it. If I want a flaming dagger then it's easier to track a recipe that needs a dagger and something to imbue rather than include all the materials for the dagger as well.
4) I prefer a logic to it. Melted skull could come from molten enemies or from killing a fire weak enemy with fire.
5) I imagine there will be a reasonably high drop rate for boss items as well as a way to transmute materials.
6) I'd prefer a drop rate that's roughly 30% for a crafting material. Any item or gear drops could be lower. Crafting items as rewards or in chests don't sit right with me. If I go out of my way to do or find something then I don't want the reward to be something I could've grinded for a few minutes to get any other location.
7) it looks set to be the Medusa of the game and might have a shard that mitigates it's trolling (petrification resistance).
8) it might end up with the ability to become incredibly easy but that's the nature of any rpg oriented game when the player grinds.
9) my guess is that shards receive their abilities from the monster they are embedded in. As such their crafting use may be limited to transferring their power to make new items. That or Johannes lacks the knowledge to fuse or alter them.
10) I think dismantling should be reserved for reclaiming materials. Using it to get an exclusive material from a rare or unique item sounds convoluted and discouraging to 100% completion.
11) over leveled characters is a possibility. Though, like many other RPGs, it's up to the player if they want to use an optional feature and to what extent.
12) I won't mind a few of the strongest pieces of great being crafting exclusive along with an item or two required to be made for the sake of tutorial. Aside from that I believe it should be something the player can avoid entirely and still complete the story.

Last Edit: Feb 1, 2018 14:46:36 GMT -6 by allooutrick

LeoLeWolferoux
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Crafting: 12 questions! Feb 1, 2018 14:41:36 GMT -6

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Post by LeoLeWolferoux on Feb 1, 2018 14:41:36 GMT -6

Haha, I can't say that I'm surprised that Pure Miriam created this thread, nor that Enkeria was the first to respond.

I strongly believe that using shards could be an integral part of creating new items. They did it in Dawn, why not Ritual?

People are secretly robots. The heart runs on an electric pulse, emotions are chemical reactions in the brain, and your diet contains metal.

...what more is there to say?

allooutrick
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Crafting: 12 questions! Feb 1, 2018 14:49:13 GMT -6 via mobile Galamoth and LeoLeWolferoux like this

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Post by allooutrick on Feb 1, 2018 14:49:13 GMT -6

Feb 1, 2018 14:41:36 GMT -6 LeoLeWolferoux said:

Haha, I can't say that I'm surprised that Pure Miriam created this thread, nor that Enkeria was the first to respond.

I strongly believe that using shards could be an integral part of creating new items. They did it in Dawn, why not Ritual?

CastleStained: Dawn of the Ritual. Lol sorry just got a kick from the thought.

Clear
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Crafting: 12 questions! Feb 1, 2018 15:59:09 GMT -6

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Post by Clear on Feb 1, 2018 15:59:09 GMT -6

Did you liked Bloodstained crafting system, considering what we know so far?
Yes. After seeing the video, I did not feel disappointed at all about the crafting system. Honestly I would be happy if they kept it as how it was shown.

The crafting system has a list of things that you can craft. That means you cannot craft something just by having the materials to do it, you need to have what you want to create, on that list. How do you think that list is going to be updated? By finding new "recipes"? By leveling up Miriam? By progressing in the game? By finding relevant materials that would add new things to the list?
Through game progression seems to be obvious in how to obtain some crafting recipies. Buying recipies at a "recipie store" would work fine as well. But I think it would be really cool if the crafting system "tells you 'hey! you can now craft Z because I happened to scan your item bag and found that you have plenty of X and Y!'"

Some itens require other itens (not just materials) to be crafted. High Potion and High Ether requires Potion and Ether to be crafted, while Lohengrin, Schedar and Lightning Bolt requires Gram (a type of Sword, a mythological one). That can create a convoluted system where you need to find A to craft B and use the crafted B to create a C. What do you think of that? Fun because it makes you grind, search and find more stuff, or boring because you need to many things to reach the result you want?
It will be fun! Such crafting would be the least convoluted if Miriam happens to collect enough of the required multi-level crafting for a particular item during a relatively normal playthrough of a few sections of the game's story. But even if that's not the case, I expect a crafting system to have at least one additional degree of complexity such as this, and would be totally fine with that.

In the past, IGA said that he wanted the game's drops to be related to enemy parts, such as head, body, etc. Some of the materials there seen to be generic, such as Melted Skull or Tail. Do you want materials to follow some kind of logic (like, any enemy with a tail, should have a chance to drop the generic "tail" material, any enemy with a skull should drop some kind of skull) or w0uld you prefer if the game had materials scatered around enemies without the need to follow a rigid logic behind it?
Makes a heck of a lot of sense that a monster having a predominant body feature would have a pretty-much guaranteed chance of dropping that particular part upon defeat. As an example, for a rat-like monster, the percentage of drop rate would be: Rat Tail 80% - Rat Fur 15% - Rat Whiskers 5%

The sword Schedar requires "Vepar Fangs" to be crafted. Vepar is a boss. Do you think bosses will drop materials for crafting? If that's so, how that will work out? They will have 100% chance of dropping (since they are bosses and usually fought only once), or maybe bosses that CAN be normal enemies later on could have a normal drop rate? Or the game could have some kind of system to summon bosses again to fight them and make them drop their stuff?
It makes total sense to me for a 100% drop rate during a boss fight such as Vepar. For bosses turned normal enemies, I'd expect them now to have a 'rare drop' available in addition to the initial encounter drop.

Regarding drop rates, what do you expect or want, regarding materials? Low or high drop chances overall? Also, would you like to find materials scatered around the game, inside chests and such? As prize for quests, among other ways to obtain them?
High drop rate overall, if we are talking about across all monsters. I would not want anything like a 0.00001% drop rate ridiculousness in my Bloodstained. Crafting items that can only be found by completing side quests will be fine. I'm expecting at least one unique crafting item to be found by each of the various methods that Iga will implement.

This updated also presented us with a new bat-like enemy (without official name yet). Do you think that enemy will have a shard? If yes, what type and how it would be?
Hmm... can't really say for sure, but I'd expect it to have a blue-colored shard. But really, other than that, I don't know.

The options menu that quickly shows in the crafting system, shows cooking and shards (and also something that looks like dismantle itens). Regarding cooking, do you think the game may end up being too easy if it has several potions and food types, considering the game's cap for itens seems to be 99?
I don't think it'll make the game easy in and of itself. Crafting 99 potions or 99 omelettes right before stepping through a boss door to fight a boss for the first time makes way more sense than crafting 99 potions "'cuz I can".

Regarding Shards, how do you think they will integrate into the crafting system? Adding up Shards to level themselves up? Maybe using them to give special effects to weapons and equipment? Or maybe, using Shards to create totally new ones?
I think shards will augment weapons, armor, and accessories based on the shards' elemental properties. For example, if Miriam takes a Katana and mixes in a yellow shard with it, the result will be a Katana with an electricity element (assuming that the yellow shard represents the electricity element, of course). Creating new shards makes sense, such as combining 1 Yellow shard with 1 Blue shard to create 1 Green shard, etc. As far as adding up shards to level them up, I don't think that will be a good idea and will add an unnecessary degree of complexity to JUST the shard mechanics.

Regarding the last option in the menu, that LOOKS LIKE dismantling, what do you think of it? Would you like if the game had, like, a very rare material that can only be obtained by dismantling a very rare piece of equipment or something like that?
I think this is a great idea. Dismantling can not only be the only way of obtaining certain crafting material, but also common ones as well.

Do you think that, with the crafting system, the game may turn into a "grind feast" in order to obtain materials needed to craft things as quickly as possible? What would be the outcomes of this?
This pretty much depends on the player. I for one will play it like a spiritual successor to SotN and a long-overdue high quality 2D Igavania masterpiece, with crafting as purely an afterthought. Crafting will be a "grindfest" if I am genuinely having fun crafting and am fine with some gameplay distraction time enjoyment. I'm expecting that heavy use of the crafting system will not be a gameplay completion requirement, including something like making sure I always have 99 of anything at all times. And I don't think Iga wants to make a game where a player is constantly worried about what hasn't been crafted yet. I'm expecting that the requirement for opening the boss door to the Bloodless fight will not require crafting 99 red roses, 99 rubies, 99 chocolates, AND 99 wall macs.

Crafting should be optional? (everything you can craft, you would be able to find in the game, abeit in a harder way).
Mostly yes. I think equipment items found in the wild cannot already have a shard ability, since this will require crafting. And all plot-progression items should only be found during normal gameplay.

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Ryngar Acia
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Crafting: 12 questions! Feb 2, 2018 6:33:02 GMT -6

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Post by Ryngar Acia on Feb 2, 2018 6:33:02 GMT -6

1) Did you liked Bloodstained crafting system, considering what we know so far?

Yeah. Seems like it could be a fun diversion.

2) The crafting system has a list of things that you can craft. That means you cannot craft something just by having the materials to do it, you need to have what you want to create, on that list. How do you think that list is going to be updated? By finding new "recipes"? By leveling up Miriam? By progressing in the game? By finding relevant materials that would add new things to the list?

I'm thinking maybe new recipes can be unlocked by bringing "scrolls" that are hidden thoughout the castle and/or purchased from Dominique, back to Johannes.

3) Some itens require other itens (not just materials) to be crafted. High Potion and High Ether requires Potion and Ether to be crafted, while Lohengrin, Schedar and Lightning Bolt requires Gram (a type of Sword, a mythological one). That can create a convoluted system where you need to find A to craft B and use the crafted B to create a C. What do you think of that? Fun because it makes you grind, search and find more stuff, or boring because you need to many things to reach the result you want?

I think its a neat feature. I kinda like the the idea of being able to make my high potions and such, rather than having to buy or find them.

I'd probably to be more cautious when it comes to messing around with my weapons, though.

4) In the past, IGA said that he wanted the game's drops to be related to enemy parts, such as head, body, etc. Some of the materials there seen to be generic, such as Melted Skull or Tail. Do you want materials to follow some kind of logic (like, any enemy with a tail, should have a chance to drop the generic "tail" material, any enemy with a skull should drop some kind of skull) or w0uld you prefer if the game had materials scatered around enemies without the need to follow a rigid logic behind it?

Mmm.. I don't really have a preference on that one.

5) The sword Schedar requires "Vepar Fangs" to be crafted. Vepar is a boss. Do you think bosses will drop materials for crafting? If that's so, how that will work out? They will have 100% chance of dropping (since they are bosses and usually fought only once), or maybe bosses that CAN be normal enemies later on could have a normal drop rate? Or the game could have some kind of system to summon bosses again to fight them and make them drop their stuff?

That part about summoning/reviving bosses sounds pretty cool, actually! :)

Alternatively, maybe we could buy the materials dropped by previously defeated bosses from Dominique.

6) Regarding drop rates, what do you expect or want, regarding materials? Low or high drop chances overall? Also, would you like to find materials scatered around the game, inside chests and such? As prize for quests, among other ways to obtain them?

Depends on the item I suppose? Obviously more valuable materials should less easy to obtain, either by having a low drop rate, or being a well hidden treasure.

7) This updated also presented us with a new bat-like enemy (without official name yet). Do you think that enemy will have a shard? If yes, what type and how it would be?

I guess if does have a shard, maybe it could help find hidden items using its sonar, or something.

8) The options menu that quickly shows in the crafting system, shows cooking and shards (and also something that looks like dismantle itens). Regarding cooking, do you think the game may end up being too easy if it has several potions and food types, considering the game's cap for itens seems to be 99?

Well, I have no idea how food will actually work in the game, so kinda hard to say.

I think if it's something like, eating one type of food just grants some kind of benificial status effect for a short period of time, it shouldn't make things overly easy (especially if the the effect could be cancelled out by eating someting else with a different effect).

9) Regarding Shards, how do you think they will integrate into the crafting system? Adding up Shards to level themselves up? Maybe using them to give special effects to weapons and equipment? Or maybe, using Shards to create totally new ones?

Using them to create new shards or level up old sounds good. :)

10) Regarding the last option in the menu, that LOOKS LIKE dismantling, what do you think of it? Would you like if the game had, like, a very rare material that can only be obtained by dismantling a very rare piece of equipment or something like that?

Yeah, somthing like that could make things interesting.

11) Do you think that, with the crafting system, the game may turn into a "grind feast" in order to obtain materials needed to craft things as quickly as possible? What would be the outcomes of this?

I think it will it depend on how much time the player wishes to invest into crafting stuff, really.

12) Crafting should be optional? (everything you can craft, you would be able to find in the game, abeit in a harder way).

Yeah, I think it should mostly be optional. You also should be able to get everthing else by some other means.

Although, crafting them could maybe produce like, "superior" versions of what you would normally be able too just find or buy.

Last Edit: Feb 2, 2018 6:49:28 GMT -6 by Ryngar Acia

RIP wowaka

Zechs
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Posts: 167

Crafting: 12 questions! Feb 2, 2018 22:23:38 GMT -6 via mobile

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Post by Zechs on Feb 2, 2018 22:23:38 GMT -6

1) Yes.

2) I suspect it might be discoverable items to add recipes or quests with key loot upon conclusion.

3) It has a logical simplicity to it. You can make a potion. But to make a strong potion you need a base. Like refining. As long as NG+ let's us keep getting single item materials (collector mind frame) then even better.

4) I like it. I can guess what I need to kill without second guessing the game. I have killing something you won't get relevant loot from. I also like if materials are scattered. Implies others were scavenging too. Even other creatures.

5) I'd be happy with boss reprisals, boss summons, lesser or normal enemy versions of the bosses or, and I like this one too, have spawn of those bosses show up with chance to either drop said item or drop something that can craft into said item.

6) Varied. Normal drop rate with items capable of adding to and deducting from the rate. Materials being around normal and offered for prizes all work. Works best with tiers.

7) I like to think all enemies have potential shards. Though makes more sense if they are certain kinds of enemies. Outside that, I have no comment.

8) No. Depending on difficulty, and frequency of all items needed for cooking it's unlikely anyone will get 99 easily without wasting time farming for the ready made items and cooking materials.

9) Shards being specific to the plot, I'd suspect they have specific powers. That add to a weapon buff, to add when merged with other shards. To create new and unique abilities that may or may not be present in enemies that cannot mimic Miriam.

10) Dismantling works for many reasons. Aesthetics with desired effects. It would kind of suck to spend time farming for rate equipment only to break it down for an even rarer material.
However, if breaking down items has chance of recovering rare materials, with tiers effecting the chance, that could mitigate the time spent looking for specific material.

11) Absolutely. Unless item drops are uniform and constant across the board, which defeats the crafting as all material is easy come, it'll be requiring much time to proceed with. Which is kind of bittersweet.

12) The option is nice. Multiple ways to do one thing is always great.

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Post by Pure Miriam on Feb 1, 2018 4:37:35 GMT -6

Post by Enkeria on Feb 1, 2018 7:39:58 GMT -6

Post by Galamoth on Feb 1, 2018 10:54:54 GMT -6

Post by chronogeran on Feb 1, 2018 11:01:32 GMT -6

Post by JeffCross on Feb 1, 2018 13:08:53 GMT -6

Post by allooutrick on Feb 1, 2018 13:56:16 GMT -6

Post by LeoLeWolferoux on Feb 1, 2018 14:41:36 GMT -6

Post by allooutrick on Feb 1, 2018 14:49:13 GMT -6

Post by Clear on Feb 1, 2018 15:59:09 GMT -6

Post by Ryngar Acia on Feb 2, 2018 6:33:02 GMT -6

Post by Zechs on Feb 2, 2018 22:23:38 GMT -6

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