Ixbran
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Post by Ixbran on Aug 14, 2015 17:49:14 GMT -6
Why is it TC automatically assumes that in order to be musically inclined we have to play an instrument, did he forget there are people who can sing?
Would love to partake in that poll but I sing, I don't play an instrument.
Sorry if I come off as rude with my comment it just ... how can someone forget that singing is a thing when it comes to music, really?
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Post by JordanJoestar on Aug 15, 2015 10:12:45 GMT -6
I play flamenco guitar. I basically just copy and repeat what others pass unto me. I plan on hopefully one day learning to read music sheets again though. I haven't actually played much this summer, but once school starts I'll probably get back to it to make the most of my time. It's really satisfying learning and mastering new techniques (The only thing I don't like about it is the nail maintenance... You have to spend a lot of effort taking care of them to make sure you sound your best.) You know Steve Howe?
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Post by qaantar on Aug 15, 2015 18:30:43 GMT -6
Why is it TC automatically assumes that in order to be musically inclined we have to play an instrument, did he forget there are people who can sing? Would love to partake in that poll but I sing, I don't play an instrument. Sorry if I come off as rude with my comment it just ... how can someone forget that singing is a thing when it comes to music, really? Unfortunately, I don't appear to be able to edit the poll options once it's created (if I can, somebody please tell me how, and I'll be happy to do so). So for the purposes of this poll, please consider the voice to be an instrument -- which is actually not too much of a stretch, considering that we refer to musical lines (regardless of source) as voices. Music is flexible that way. Edit: I originally wrote something equally rude, but that was hypocritical of me. So instead, I'll just say that yes, your comment was very rude as written, and saying you are sorry does not excuse it. Next time, please consider an alternate way of phrasing your concern that treats us both like rational human beings worthy of respect. Something like "Hey TC, I sing, but I don't consider the voice an instrument. Could you please edit the poll choices?"
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Ixbran
Cleric of Nintendo
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Post by Ixbran on Aug 15, 2015 18:47:08 GMT -6
It just kinda blows my mind that you had actually forgotten about it. I mean really, a persons singing capabilities are just as equally important as someones ability to play an instrument. I mean, when you turn on the radio, 90% of the music you listen too has vocals too it. So yeah, feel free to take the high road and not be rude, but that doesn't excuse the fact you some how managed to forget one of the most important parts of music. Yes singing isn't always necessary for music, but then again neither are instruments.
There's this thing, called Acapella, ya herd of it? I doubt it. Its when people make music using nothing but ones vocal cords and bodily sounds to make background music, no instruments required. The fact you could forget that singing is a thing? Yeah, no, I am not going to be nice about it. If you're not going to bother remembering that strong vocal skills are a part of those who are musically gifted, I am not going to bother being polite or sugar coat what I have to say to you.
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gunlord500
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Post by gunlord500 on Aug 15, 2015 19:26:17 GMT -6
Well, sometimes folks forget things, Ixbran, don't be too hard on him. I've forgotten a lot of very obvious things when talking to people too...there have been a few Skype conversations where I've actually forgotten the name of the person I'm talking with. XD It was an innocent mistake, qaantar didn't mean any harm, he accepted your critique and said we can consider the voice to be an instrument, so I think we should let bygones be bygones. That said, it would be convenient to be able to edit polls, especially in case we forget to add options or need to edit choice descriptions. It might be good to talk to XombieMike and see if it's an option he can enable, or if he can't do that with polls.
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Post by qaantar on Aug 15, 2015 19:30:33 GMT -6
It just kinda blows my mind that you had actually forgotten about it. I mean really, a persons singing capabilities are just as equally important as someones ability to play an instrument. I mean, when you turn on the radio, 90% of the music you listen too has vocals too it. So yeah, feel free to take the high road and not be rude, but that doesn't excuse the fact you some how managed to forget one of the most important parts of music. Yes singing isn't always necessary for music, but then again neither are instruments. There's this thing, called Acapella, ya herd of it? I doubt it. Its when people make music using nothing but ones vocal cords and bodily sounds to make background music, no instruments required. The fact you could forget that singing is a thing? Yeah, no, I am not going to be nice about it. If you're not going to bother remembering that strong vocal skills are a part of those who are musically gifted, I am not going to bother being polite or sugar coat what I have to say to you. So when you're not spewing vitriol from your mouth, what do you enjoy singing?
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Ixbran
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Post by Ixbran on Aug 15, 2015 19:43:55 GMT -6
That said, it would be convenient to be able to edit polls, especially in case we forget to add options or need to edit choice descriptions. It might be good to talk to XombieMike and see if it's an option he can enable, or if he can't do that with polls. Technically you can change a Poll, however doing so resets it and people have to vote again. When they announced there was going to be a second playable character, I went and made a topic regarding who people think the new playable character will be, with a poll asking who they think it would be. The poll options being Johannas, Gebel, shovel Armor, or Someone new. The poll initially only let people vote once. After finding out there were going to be 2 new playable characters, i changed the poll so people could make two votes, which two of the possible 4 characters we might get, however it resulted in the poll needing to be reset and people had to vote again. I figured that resetting the poll was necessary so the it would be more fair to chose from which two people wanted to see, to make it work with what new information we received. It was sad seeing those old votes having to be removed, but resetting it changed it for the better in the long run.
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Kaius
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[TI2]My heart is blood, my blood is glass, my soul is frozen.
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Post by Kaius on Aug 16, 2015 2:22:07 GMT -6
I play several instruments. Guitar mainly, and bass. I am currently learning piano and training my voice (which means it is not that good at the moment)... I am also making room in my bedroom for a drumset (while I save money of course). I always dreamed to have a cello as well because I just love how beautiful it sounds. I am keeping money for a shamisen and a shakahuchi (I love Japan and its traditional music). Oh my, I do not even know where am I going to put this and where I will find the time for all of these but I just can not accept not to had, tried and enjoyed them before dying ! I have studied musics for some years so I can read a sheet too and know some basics of theory. With all this said though, I am only an average musician in terms of skills. I rather like just enjoy, except for the guitar which is my main instrument as I told you. Music is a devorous passion but it is really good for the soul ! I hope I am not looking like an attention prick, I am not meaning too, I know there is a dozen of people who know how to play like ten instruments in pretty much a virtuoso way ! ha ! ha !
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Post by H on Aug 16, 2015 7:53:28 GMT -6
I play flamenco guitar. I basically just copy and repeat what others pass unto me. I plan on hopefully one day learning to read music sheets again though. I haven't actually played much this summer, but once school starts I'll probably get back to it to make the most of my time. It's really satisfying learning and mastering new techniques (The only thing I don't like about it is the nail maintenance... You have to spend a lot of effort taking care of them to make sure you sound your best.) You know Steve Howe? I looked him up just a bit ago just to make sure, but no I don't know of his works. The only big name I listen to in guitar is Paco De Lucia. Other than that I mostly listen to more local musicians. What do you recommend from his works?
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Post by JordanJoestar on Aug 16, 2015 12:28:25 GMT -6
I looked him up just a bit ago just to make sure, but no I don't know of his works. The only big name I listen to in guitar is Paco De Lucia. Other than that I mostly listen to more local musicians. What do you recommend from his works? Steve Howe is famous for his works with the Yes, one of the greatest Progressive Rock band of all history. His guitar technique is brilliant. Pure genius. Also, he played the flamenco guitar in Innuendo, the Queen's song that gives the name to the 1991 album of Queen and, unfortunately, the last album with the greatest, immortal and peerless Freddie Mercury.
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Brainiac
Master Librarian
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Game Guru and Bloodstained Backer
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Post by Brainiac on Aug 27, 2015 14:46:04 GMT -6
I have experience as a vocalist, cellist, and pianist. All strictly amateur, though.
And despite not being a violist, I even know how to read the alto/C clef.
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Post by ghaleon on Aug 28, 2015 19:46:29 GMT -6
I play several instruments. Guitar mainly, and bass. I am currently learning piano and training my voice (which means it is not that good at the moment)... I am also making room in my bedroom for a drumset (while I save money of course). I always dreamed to have a cello as well because I just love how beautiful it sounds. I am keeping money for a shamisen and a shakahuchi (I love Japan and its traditional music). Oh my, I do not even know where am I going to put this and where I will find the time for all of these but I just can not accept not to had, tried and enjoyed them before dying ! I have studied musics for some years so I can read a sheet too and know some basics of theory. With all this said though, I am only an average musician in terms of skills. I rather like just enjoy, except for the guitar which is my main instrument as I told you. Music is a devorous passion but it is really good for the soul ! I hope I am not looking like an attention prick, I am not meaning too, I know there is a dozen of people who know how to play like ten instruments in pretty much a virtuoso way ! ha ! ha ! I too have some experience with theory enough to have to write a thing or two... For some reason though I never really was able to remember the significance of the scales and modes and whatnot. Whenever I would have to write something, I'd know that it would be using ___ scale for the most part. But all too often there would be notes that would just sound way off even if it was somehow part of the scale, I would have to put something weird there. Oftentimes these were highlights or climaxes or really expressive parts of the song too. Maybe there's a term or pattern or logic behind that but I never learned it beyond me instinct and ear. I never forgot how to read music a single time even after never even being taught it in passing, but the whole scale/mode/etc nonsense gets forgotten after like a single week of non-use even if I was working with it for months. I don't understand. I just learn that way, if something makes sense to me and I know why it is and how it is and how it got there, I remember it, but when things are arbitrary, I cna't for the life of me remember it.
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Post by aindriu on Sept 1, 2015 21:49:29 GMT -6
I actually have a rather peculiar disorder called 'dyscalculia'. It hinders me from full mathematic comprehension up to and including reading music. However, if you were to play something for me a few times, I'd be able to easily memorize it and play it back for you.
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Master Librarian
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Post by Brainiac on Sept 2, 2015 14:19:54 GMT -6
I actually have a rather peculiar disorder called 'dyscalculia'. It hinders me from full mathematic comprehension up to and including reading music. However, if you were to play something for me a few times, I'd be able to easily memorize it and play it back for you. I know a few people who would be horrified by the assertion that music is in any way related to something as "emotionless" and "pedantic" as math (thankfully, I am not one of them; I enjoy both).
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Post by aindriu on Sept 2, 2015 14:23:24 GMT -6
I actually have a rather peculiar disorder called 'dyscalculia'. It hinders me from full mathematic comprehension up to and including reading music. However, if you were to play something for me a few times, I'd be able to easily memorize it and play it back for you. I know a few people who would be horrified by the assertion that music is in any way related to something as "emotionless" and "pedantic" as math (thankfully, I am not one of them; I enjoy both). Oh, it totally is though. I mean, there's meter, chord progression, etc. I don't know why I can intuitively play music. Any neurologists in the house that might be able to explain it?
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Post by ghaleon on Sept 2, 2015 21:04:12 GMT -6
oh god I effing hate it when musicians complain that I am playing a song wrong because I play it with no emotion...Basically if there isn't a crescendo written or a formant or it doesn't say forte and that kind of thing, I generally play at a consistent volume, and many musicians HATE that. I don't need to read the music to play it either, I instinctively know when some parts are SUPPOSED to be louder or quieter or faster owhatever. But I don't apply them to parts that are NOT written so, and apparently all music is supposed to have those variations thoughout the song. The only thing I can agree on is possibly having more emphasis on.. I forget the names.. like the first note in a bar, and the 3rd to a lesser degree in 4/4 time.. or like the 2.8th note if you have some crazy syncopation going on, that kind of thing. I understand the need to play those a bit harder sometimes to some extent, but even still I think you shouldn't do it on purpose so much as unconsciously do it due to the nature of the song and its rhythm.
But yeah, I've had some people lecture me that I play it like math too much even though I play by ear and not by reading the notes (but I can do that too).. ugh.. gah.. blargh... *hits something*.
I mean I'm not a stuck up fool who doesn't listen to their superiors and doesn't try to improve themselves, I'm very open to constructive criticism and growth, but music is art and that kind of thing is a personal style/nuance and shouldn't be forced IMO, seriously.. UGH.
edit: on second thought, even the first notes and whatnot shouldn't NEED some emphasis... I say this because my favorite instrument, a cathedral pipe organ... cannot play one note louder than another, regardless of if you gently tap a key, or mash the darn thing into the ground. so BS... ARRRGH.
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Master Librarian
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Post by Brainiac on Sept 3, 2015 7:02:32 GMT -6
I don't know why I can intuitively play music. Any neurologists in the house that might be able to explain it? Fraid not. My biology background is genetic, not neurologic. Though there are a few quick articles I found on the importance and nature of musical intuition: mic.com/articles/88357/science-shows-how-guitar-players-brains-are-actually-different-from-everybody-elseswww.psychologytoday.com/blog/imagine/201003/einstein-creative-thinking-music-and-the-intuitive-art-scientific-imaginationstuartbahn.com/academic-versus-intuitive-approaches-to-music/oh god I effing hate it when musicians complain that I am playing a song wrong because I play it with no emotion...Basically if there isn't a crescendo written or a formant or it doesn't say forte and that kind of thing, I generally play at a consistent volume, and many musicians HATE that. I don't need to read the music to play it either, I instinctively know when some parts are SUPPOSED to be louder or quieter or faster owhatever. But I don't apply them to parts that are NOT written so, and apparently all music is supposed to have those variations thoughout the song. The only thing I can agree on is possibly having more emphasis on.. I forget the names.. like the first note in a bar, and the 3rd to a lesser degree in 4/4 time.. or like the 2.8th note if you have some crazy syncopation going on, that kind of thing. I understand the need to play those a bit harder sometimes to some extent, but even still I think you shouldn't do it on purpose so much as unconsciously do it due to the nature of the song and its rhythm. But yeah, I've had some people lecture me that I play it like math too much even though I play by ear and not by reading the notes (but I can do that too).. ugh.. gah.. blargh... *hits something*. I mean I'm not a stuck up fool who doesn't listen to their superiors and doesn't try to improve themselves, I'm very open to constructive criticism and growth, but music is art and that kind of thing is a personal style/nuance and shouldn't be forced IMO, seriously.. UGH. edit: on second thought, even the first notes and whatnot shouldn't NEED some emphasis... I say this because my favorite instrument, a cathedral pipe organ... cannot play one note louder than another, regardless of if you gently tap a key, or mash the darn thing into the ground. so BS... ARRRGH. Your question about the names for the rhythmic patterns in 4/4 time - they're called on-beats and off-beats, also referred to strong vs. weak or stressed vs. unstressed beats. It always amuses me how many terms there can be for something singular and specific. And yeah, people who complain about subjective emotional content in music can be a nuisance. I for one enjoy math immensely and fully recognize how music is built upon fundamental mathematical principles. Heck, I can appreciate the beauty of something like Euler's identity,
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Post by aindriu on Sept 3, 2015 8:24:14 GMT -6
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Post by ghaleon on Sept 3, 2015 20:52:00 GMT -6
I'm no expert with math OR music, but music has a strong relationship to patterns. And math also has a relationship to patterns.
I think the biggest relationship between music and math however is that its written notation was kind of deliberately made to be semi-mathimatical, simply because that's something virtually everyone has some familiarity with.
I think this makes alot more sense in my head than what I wrote.
I mean I think people intentionally make music's written notation to be as math-like as possible. For any relationship music itself has to math, the written form magnifies it intentionally. To the point that anything non-math related could also seem to have some relation if you go out of yoru way to express it using something seemingly math-like.
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Post by aindriu on Sept 3, 2015 22:58:08 GMT -6
I'm no expert with math OR music, but music has a strong relationship to patterns. And math also has a relationship to patterns. I think the biggest relationship between music and math however is that its written notation was kind of deliberately made to be semi-mathimatical, simply because that's something virtually everyone has some familiarity with. I think this makes alot more sense in my head than what I wrote. I mean I think people intentionally make music's written notation to be as math-like as possible. For any relationship music itself has to math, the written form magnifies it intentionally. To the point that anything non-math related could also seem to have some relation if you go out of yoru way to express it using something seemingly math-like. I'm pickin' up what you're layin' down.
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